<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>ajdecon</author><text>I took the same route, &quot;mastering out&quot;, and that cultural perception that &quot;leaving your PhD is failing at life&quot; was my biggest hurdle.  I knew I could get a job, knew that I could probably find something interesting, but the looks of pity and disgust from my colleagues were not so easy to ignore.  I think the comment I heard most often was, &quot;what a waste.&quot;&lt;p&gt;Until I was actually out. Then I started getting furtive emails asking me questions like, &quot;how do you write a resume?&quot;, &quot;is the pay ok?&quot;, and most often, &quot;are you happy?&quot;&lt;p&gt;I still think a PhD is &lt;i&gt;absolutely&lt;/i&gt; worth it in many cases, and trains you to be a scientist better than any other path. But it&apos;s a long hard road, and there are many people out there (me included) who do it because it&apos;s presented as the default path. If you&apos;re interested in physics, or biology, or any other science, it&apos;s just what comes next after undergrad. And that&apos;s not a good enough reason.&lt;p&gt;Edit: &apos;You know, most Ph.D.ers are smart and successful people. Hence they have a difficulty in saying “This is not for me”. They instead say “I’ve been successful all my life, and I finished everything I started, so I should finish this as well”. By saying that, they choose to hang in there for many years in a depressed state.&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;This&lt;/i&gt;.</text><parent_chain><item><author>sunahsuh</author><text>I recently left my PhD program too (I&apos;m &quot;mastering out&quot; in local parlance ;)) and what this post doesn&apos;t address is what I found to be the hardest part: making a decision to leave a world where people that leave are construed as a failures (note: contrary to my expectation, I&apos;ve only received support in my decision from my awesome and anomalous department.) (Also, I should note that I left a software industry job to do the PhD so I knew I shouldn&apos;t have difficulty finding a job.)&lt;p&gt;For anyone who wants to take the leap but is afraid or unsure, I offer some words that were incredibly helpful for me from some of fantastic friends. To quote my amazing advisor from his response to my &quot;I&apos;m leaving&quot; email:&lt;p&gt;&apos;We had a Head of Department at Lancaster who used to stomp around the corridors moaning - &quot;I&apos;ve just lost another student to industry. He&apos;s got a great job, has a starting salary bigger than mine, is working on a fabulous project with better resources than we have. In what mad world is this judged as a failure?&quot;&apos;&lt;p&gt;And another colleague, who&apos;s currently a junior professor:
&apos;You know, most Ph.D.ers are smart and successful people. Hence they have a difficulty in saying “This is not for me”. They instead say “I’ve been successful all my life, and I finished everything I started, so I should finish this as well”. By saying that, they choose to hang in there for many years in a depressed state.&lt;p&gt;Sometimes, the most courageous thing and the best thing to do is to quit when you know you would rather work in another capacity, or when you know you don’t want to work in academia. I congratulate you on your decision and I hope the best for you. ( In case you later decide to come back to academia, it will be waiting for you, so I would not worry about it.)&apos;&lt;p&gt;Best of luck, those of you that are struggling with the decision. If you&apos;re anything like me, if you decide to leave you&apos;ll feel better than you have in years =)</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>How to leave academia (for science PhDs)</title><url>http://www.chrisstucchio.com/blog/2012/leaving_academia.html</url></story>
<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>_delirium</author><text>Part of that&apos;s due to incentives; like a corporation, universities don&apos;t primarily think institutionally about what&apos;s in &lt;i&gt;your&lt;/i&gt; best interests. Hence you also rarely find companies happy that you left to take a better job, though you might find some individual managers who&apos;re supportive of a decision to move on.&lt;p&gt;For universities, people who leave PhD programs earlyish are a particular negative, because at least in the US, typically universities subsidize the masters portion of your education if you enter into a PhD program, out of research funds or departmental TA funds, whereas students who enter explicitly intending to get a masters have to pay tuition, and don&apos;t usually receive a stipend (though a few can land TAships). What they expect in return is that later in your PhD you&apos;ll publish a bunch of papers which bring them some prestige, help out on grant applications, etc. So if you enter a PhD program, stay for 2 years for the coursework/masters portion, and then leave, from the university&apos;s perspective it&apos;s like you&apos;re really a masters student who somehow tricked them into treating you as a PhD student for 2 years, and got away without paying tuition--- but without staying long enough to produce the expected ROI in publications. It also hurts the graduation-rate statistics in some ways of calculating them, and as education is getting more metrics/assessment heavy, that can matter too.&lt;p&gt;At least, that&apos;s from an administrative/bean-counter perspective; from a cultural perspective among researchers themselves, attitudes are more varied and have more complicated reasons. In areas where industrial partnerships are important, I think the reaction is often fairly positive, because a former student now working at a large company is a good connection for a lab to have.&lt;p&gt;Some of the negative reactions I think are just due to people not conceiving that other people could have different preferences/aptitudes. You can also find the reverse, where e.g. the attitudes if you left a startup after two years to pursue grad school can range from confused to &quot;you&apos;re throwing away a golden opportunity&quot; type views, to outright derisive (&quot;couldn&apos;t make it in the real world&quot;). Unfortunately I think it&apos;s pretty common for people to be pretty invested in what &lt;i&gt;they&lt;/i&gt; did as the definition of success (whether it&apos;s research or entrepreneurship or whatever), and to generalize that to thinking that people who quit that route and try another one are therefore failures.</text><parent_chain><item><author>sunahsuh</author><text>I recently left my PhD program too (I&apos;m &quot;mastering out&quot; in local parlance ;)) and what this post doesn&apos;t address is what I found to be the hardest part: making a decision to leave a world where people that leave are construed as a failures (note: contrary to my expectation, I&apos;ve only received support in my decision from my awesome and anomalous department.) (Also, I should note that I left a software industry job to do the PhD so I knew I shouldn&apos;t have difficulty finding a job.)&lt;p&gt;For anyone who wants to take the leap but is afraid or unsure, I offer some words that were incredibly helpful for me from some of fantastic friends. To quote my amazing advisor from his response to my &quot;I&apos;m leaving&quot; email:&lt;p&gt;&apos;We had a Head of Department at Lancaster who used to stomp around the corridors moaning - &quot;I&apos;ve just lost another student to industry. He&apos;s got a great job, has a starting salary bigger than mine, is working on a fabulous project with better resources than we have. In what mad world is this judged as a failure?&quot;&apos;&lt;p&gt;And another colleague, who&apos;s currently a junior professor:
&apos;You know, most Ph.D.ers are smart and successful people. Hence they have a difficulty in saying “This is not for me”. They instead say “I’ve been successful all my life, and I finished everything I started, so I should finish this as well”. By saying that, they choose to hang in there for many years in a depressed state.&lt;p&gt;Sometimes, the most courageous thing and the best thing to do is to quit when you know you would rather work in another capacity, or when you know you don’t want to work in academia. I congratulate you on your decision and I hope the best for you. ( In case you later decide to come back to academia, it will be waiting for you, so I would not worry about it.)&apos;&lt;p&gt;Best of luck, those of you that are struggling with the decision. If you&apos;re anything like me, if you decide to leave you&apos;ll feel better than you have in years =)</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>How to leave academia (for science PhDs)</title><url>http://www.chrisstucchio.com/blog/2012/leaving_academia.html</url></story>