<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>michael1999</author><text>Forbes ranks public, acknowledged wealth.  Regents, oligarchs, gangsters, opaque family trusts, etc. are out of scope.</text><parent_chain><item><author>rascul</author><text>Who is richer? Forbes says he&amp;#x27;s #1.&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.forbes.com&amp;#x2F;billionaires&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.forbes.com&amp;#x2F;billionaires&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>mc32</author><text>Richest from running a public company [holding stocks] not necessarily the richest overall.</text></item><item><author>danso</author><text>He&amp;#x27;s literally the richest man in the world. If the leaker&amp;#x27;s purported motive is to expose tax avoidance by the ultrawealthy, it would be very strange for Bezos to &lt;i&gt;not&lt;/i&gt; be in the leaked data.&lt;p&gt;I don&amp;#x27;t think ProPublica describes in exact specificity the scope of the data, other than it contains &amp;quot;the tax returns of thousands of the nation&amp;#x27;s wealthiest people, covering more than 15 years&amp;quot;. And it includes Warren Buffett, Rupert Murdoch, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison, Mike Bloomberg, Carl Icahn, and Elon Musk — a group of guys who, along with Bezos, are not considered to be politically aligned.</text></item><item><author>koheripbal</author><text>I don&amp;#x27;t think it&amp;#x27;s any coincidence that Jeff Bezos specifically was leaked.&lt;p&gt;He has been straying into politics in DC very very heavily, and it looks like he&amp;#x27;s making enemies.  I suspect that is also the reason we see near-daily anti-Amazon posts on social media.</text></item><item><author>danso</author><text>&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;It&amp;#x27;s everything we&amp;#x27;ve already known.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;A more interesting question is how did ProPublica get a copy of Jeff Bezos&amp;#x27; tax returns. Seems like a leak at the IRS?&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;Yes the actual tax records are what make the story interesting, even if the data only confirms what “everyone knows” — at least there’s actual data and empirical analysis of the scope.&lt;p&gt;According to this accompanying explainer, the leak is anonymous:&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.propublica.org&amp;#x2F;article&amp;#x2F;why-we-are-publishing-the-tax-secrets-of-the-001&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.propublica.org&amp;#x2F;article&amp;#x2F;why-we-are-publishing-the...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;A second question certain to arise is the motives and identity of the source who has provided this data to ProPublica. We live in an age in which people with access to information can copy it with the click of a mouse and transmit it in a variety of ways to news organizations. Many years ago, ProPublica and other news organizations set up secure systems that allow whistleblowers to transmit information to us without revealing their identity.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;We do not know the identity of our source. We did not solicit the information they sent us. The source says they were motivated by our previous coverage of issues surrounding the IRS and tax enforcement, but we do not know for certain that is true. We have considered the possibility that information we have received could have come from a state actor hostile to American interests. In particular, a number of government agencies were compromised last year by what the U.S. has said were Russian hackers who exploited vulnerabilities in software sold by SolarWinds, a Texas-based information technology company. We do note, however, that the Treasury Department’s inspector general for tax administration wrote in December that, “At this time, there is no evidence that any taxpayer information was exposed” in the SolarWinds hack.&lt;/i&gt;</text></item><item><author>koheripbal</author><text>Summary:&lt;p&gt;1. Capital Gain taxes are delayed until you actually sell the stock.&lt;p&gt;2. Corporate taxes are being reduced because companies are moving profits to foreign jurisdictions.&lt;p&gt;3. Estate taxes &amp;amp; income taxes are being avoided by the creation of charitable foundations.&lt;p&gt;The 2nd and 3rd points are very valid, and I wish the author had spent more time on them.  Unfortunately instead, the author spends much more time on point 1, conflating wealth with income, and avoiding the obvious argument that capital gains are &lt;i&gt;eventually&lt;/i&gt; taxed - the rich are not escaping that.&lt;p&gt;...unless point 3 (foundation) occurs.  And that should be the main story.&lt;p&gt;Squabbling over a wealth tax is not useful.  The real issue is that the super rich create these personal &amp;quot;foundations&amp;quot; that act as never-taxed income holes, and then use them as personal and political tools.&lt;p&gt;In total, there&amp;#x27;s nothing very revealing about this article.  It&amp;#x27;s everything we&amp;#x27;ve already known.  IMO, we need to curb foreign tax havens, and severely limit tax exemptions for charitable donations.&lt;p&gt;A more interesting question is how did ProPublica get a copy of Jeff Bezos&amp;#x27; tax returns.  Seems like a leak at the IRS?</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>IRS records reveal how the wealthiest avoid income tax</title><url>https://www.propublica.org/article/the-secret-irs-files-trove-of-never-before-seen-records-reveal-how-the-wealthiest-avoid-income-tax</url></story>
<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>bidirectional</author><text>People whose wealth cannot be calculated as known equity valuation * disclosed equity held. That doesn&amp;#x27;t necessarily mean anyone is richer, but they very well could be.</text><parent_chain><item><author>rascul</author><text>Who is richer? Forbes says he&amp;#x27;s #1.&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.forbes.com&amp;#x2F;billionaires&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.forbes.com&amp;#x2F;billionaires&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>mc32</author><text>Richest from running a public company [holding stocks] not necessarily the richest overall.</text></item><item><author>danso</author><text>He&amp;#x27;s literally the richest man in the world. If the leaker&amp;#x27;s purported motive is to expose tax avoidance by the ultrawealthy, it would be very strange for Bezos to &lt;i&gt;not&lt;/i&gt; be in the leaked data.&lt;p&gt;I don&amp;#x27;t think ProPublica describes in exact specificity the scope of the data, other than it contains &amp;quot;the tax returns of thousands of the nation&amp;#x27;s wealthiest people, covering more than 15 years&amp;quot;. And it includes Warren Buffett, Rupert Murdoch, Mark Zuckerberg, Larry Ellison, Mike Bloomberg, Carl Icahn, and Elon Musk — a group of guys who, along with Bezos, are not considered to be politically aligned.</text></item><item><author>koheripbal</author><text>I don&amp;#x27;t think it&amp;#x27;s any coincidence that Jeff Bezos specifically was leaked.&lt;p&gt;He has been straying into politics in DC very very heavily, and it looks like he&amp;#x27;s making enemies.  I suspect that is also the reason we see near-daily anti-Amazon posts on social media.</text></item><item><author>danso</author><text>&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;It&amp;#x27;s everything we&amp;#x27;ve already known.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;A more interesting question is how did ProPublica get a copy of Jeff Bezos&amp;#x27; tax returns. Seems like a leak at the IRS?&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;Yes the actual tax records are what make the story interesting, even if the data only confirms what “everyone knows” — at least there’s actual data and empirical analysis of the scope.&lt;p&gt;According to this accompanying explainer, the leak is anonymous:&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.propublica.org&amp;#x2F;article&amp;#x2F;why-we-are-publishing-the-tax-secrets-of-the-001&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.propublica.org&amp;#x2F;article&amp;#x2F;why-we-are-publishing-the...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;A second question certain to arise is the motives and identity of the source who has provided this data to ProPublica. We live in an age in which people with access to information can copy it with the click of a mouse and transmit it in a variety of ways to news organizations. Many years ago, ProPublica and other news organizations set up secure systems that allow whistleblowers to transmit information to us without revealing their identity.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; &lt;i&gt;We do not know the identity of our source. We did not solicit the information they sent us. The source says they were motivated by our previous coverage of issues surrounding the IRS and tax enforcement, but we do not know for certain that is true. We have considered the possibility that information we have received could have come from a state actor hostile to American interests. In particular, a number of government agencies were compromised last year by what the U.S. has said were Russian hackers who exploited vulnerabilities in software sold by SolarWinds, a Texas-based information technology company. We do note, however, that the Treasury Department’s inspector general for tax administration wrote in December that, “At this time, there is no evidence that any taxpayer information was exposed” in the SolarWinds hack.&lt;/i&gt;</text></item><item><author>koheripbal</author><text>Summary:&lt;p&gt;1. Capital Gain taxes are delayed until you actually sell the stock.&lt;p&gt;2. Corporate taxes are being reduced because companies are moving profits to foreign jurisdictions.&lt;p&gt;3. Estate taxes &amp;amp; income taxes are being avoided by the creation of charitable foundations.&lt;p&gt;The 2nd and 3rd points are very valid, and I wish the author had spent more time on them.  Unfortunately instead, the author spends much more time on point 1, conflating wealth with income, and avoiding the obvious argument that capital gains are &lt;i&gt;eventually&lt;/i&gt; taxed - the rich are not escaping that.&lt;p&gt;...unless point 3 (foundation) occurs.  And that should be the main story.&lt;p&gt;Squabbling over a wealth tax is not useful.  The real issue is that the super rich create these personal &amp;quot;foundations&amp;quot; that act as never-taxed income holes, and then use them as personal and political tools.&lt;p&gt;In total, there&amp;#x27;s nothing very revealing about this article.  It&amp;#x27;s everything we&amp;#x27;ve already known.  IMO, we need to curb foreign tax havens, and severely limit tax exemptions for charitable donations.&lt;p&gt;A more interesting question is how did ProPublica get a copy of Jeff Bezos&amp;#x27; tax returns.  Seems like a leak at the IRS?</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>IRS records reveal how the wealthiest avoid income tax</title><url>https://www.propublica.org/article/the-secret-irs-files-trove-of-never-before-seen-records-reveal-how-the-wealthiest-avoid-income-tax</url></story>