<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>serf</author><text>MacDonald as &amp;#x27;not subversive&amp;#x27; is a crackup.&lt;p&gt;A famous schtick of his on his podcast later on was to get other comedians to accidentally joke about the 9&amp;#x2F;11 events, and then he&amp;#x27;d frame them as monsters for making light of the situation. He got fired from SNL for railing on OJ Simpson and his executive buddies at NBC, he got &amp;#x27;removed&amp;#x27; from Silverman&amp;#x27;s JASH &amp;#x27;collective&amp;#x27; for making jokes about &amp;#x27;Arabs&amp;#x27;, and he subverted the Friar&amp;#x27;s Club roast by refusing to be rude and only saying 1940s formal-appropriate Vaudeville-act stuff.&lt;p&gt;The SNL stuff was &lt;i&gt;big&lt;/i&gt; news in entertainment at the time. He got interviewed by all the big late-night shows about it and the unfair process, was on Stern, etc etc. The whole nation sort of rallied behind him and agreed that SNL&amp;#x2F;Lorne Michaels acted unfairly at a time when the entire nation was also seemingly against Simpson.&lt;p&gt;His outward clean-cut demeanor and presence is exactly what made him so subversive.</text><parent_chain><item><author>AlbertCory</author><text>You are both right, in that they &lt;i&gt;were&lt;/i&gt; counterculture. However:&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; comedians are supposed to be subversive&lt;p&gt;No, that&amp;#x27;s just your preference. Jay Leno and Norm MacDonald are not subversive at all; just funny. &lt;i&gt;Most&lt;/i&gt; of the Smothers&amp;#x27; comedy was family-friendly, but they did push a few buttons sometimes.&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; I hope you talk in a more informed way about time you know&lt;p&gt;Totally unwarranted.</text></item><item><author>drewcoo</author><text>[flagged]</text></item><item><author>skyechurch</author><text>Here&amp;#x27;s a good synopsis of the Smothers Brothers and their importance for that generation of comedians:
&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.hollywoodreporter.com&amp;#x2F;tv&amp;#x2F;tv-news&amp;#x2F;smothers-brothers-comedy-hour-oral-history-1060153&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.hollywoodreporter.com&amp;#x2F;tv&amp;#x2F;tv-news&amp;#x2F;smothers-brothe...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Comedy, in general, ages very badly, but the Smothers Brothers are still very funny.  They were politically &amp;quot;controversial&amp;quot;, but they were the furthest thing from shock comics, and I think that&amp;#x27;s what makes their comedy translate 50+ years later.  Nothing is as dated as last season&amp;#x27;s transgressiveness, but their routines were sharp but welcoming, you could watch them with your grandparents and your children and everyone would have a laugh.  They were well before my time, but I remember seeing them brought out on Letterman, etc, expecting a dire nostalgia act, and they just kill.  A great act for any decade.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>Comedian Tom Smothers has died</title><url>https://apnews.com/article/tom-smothers-dies-smothers-brothers-3e1727faf1b6469da7b2cfc7b2874c56</url></story>
<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>nyczomg</author><text>Norm MacDonald not subversive at all?  Really?&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;ultimateclassicrock.com&amp;#x2F;norm-macdonald-last-weekend-update&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;ultimateclassicrock.com&amp;#x2F;norm-macdonald-last-weekend-...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=t_lXBLqAOW8&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=t_lXBLqAOW8&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=SOsfrppKd1k&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=SOsfrppKd1k&lt;/a&gt;</text><parent_chain><item><author>AlbertCory</author><text>You are both right, in that they &lt;i&gt;were&lt;/i&gt; counterculture. However:&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; comedians are supposed to be subversive&lt;p&gt;No, that&amp;#x27;s just your preference. Jay Leno and Norm MacDonald are not subversive at all; just funny. &lt;i&gt;Most&lt;/i&gt; of the Smothers&amp;#x27; comedy was family-friendly, but they did push a few buttons sometimes.&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; I hope you talk in a more informed way about time you know&lt;p&gt;Totally unwarranted.</text></item><item><author>drewcoo</author><text>[flagged]</text></item><item><author>skyechurch</author><text>Here&amp;#x27;s a good synopsis of the Smothers Brothers and their importance for that generation of comedians:
&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.hollywoodreporter.com&amp;#x2F;tv&amp;#x2F;tv-news&amp;#x2F;smothers-brothers-comedy-hour-oral-history-1060153&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.hollywoodreporter.com&amp;#x2F;tv&amp;#x2F;tv-news&amp;#x2F;smothers-brothe...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Comedy, in general, ages very badly, but the Smothers Brothers are still very funny.  They were politically &amp;quot;controversial&amp;quot;, but they were the furthest thing from shock comics, and I think that&amp;#x27;s what makes their comedy translate 50+ years later.  Nothing is as dated as last season&amp;#x27;s transgressiveness, but their routines were sharp but welcoming, you could watch them with your grandparents and your children and everyone would have a laugh.  They were well before my time, but I remember seeing them brought out on Letterman, etc, expecting a dire nostalgia act, and they just kill.  A great act for any decade.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>Comedian Tom Smothers has died</title><url>https://apnews.com/article/tom-smothers-dies-smothers-brothers-3e1727faf1b6469da7b2cfc7b2874c56</url></story>