<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>fsloth</author><text>&amp;quot;Everyone&amp;quot; here I think means the same as &amp;quot;anyone can be a great cook&amp;quot; in Ratatuille - it does not mean that anyone &lt;i&gt;can&lt;/i&gt; learn to cook - but that a good programmer can arise from any background.&lt;p&gt;My experience would support this. You need a mindset keen towards rigor, and motivation. Given those, and guidance, anyone can learn to program - at least in limited contexts.</text><parent_chain><item><author>andrewstuart</author><text>&amp;quot;You can teach everyone to be a great programmer&amp;quot;&lt;p&gt;Flat out dead wrong.  If you hire &amp;quot;anyone&amp;quot; and try to teach them to be a programmer then you will probably fire them.&lt;p&gt;This is the sort of attitude that leads companies to outsource their development overseas: &amp;quot;Our programmers are people hitting keys. We&amp;#x27;ll get overseas people to hit keys and overseas people hit keys for less money.&amp;quot;, cause, you know, anyone can do it.&lt;p&gt;Programming is VERY hard and it takes a huge amount of motivation and hard work to become any good at it.  Sure you can learn how to do simple stuff without any serious interest, but to be beyond ordinary it takes enormous work and time and research and Joe Schlepp off the street is simply not going to do that.&lt;p&gt;If you want to hire people and teach them then you need to look for these things: enthusiasm for computers and programming, demonstrated willingness to learn, energy and effort.  You should value energy and effort more highly than anything. Those are the raw ingredients for trainees, and people with those ingredients are far from &amp;quot;anyone&amp;quot;.</text></item><item><author>struppi</author><text>Also: Give the &amp;quot;not-the-best&amp;quot; people a chance to develop.&lt;p&gt;The CEO of one of my past clients, a consulting company, always said: &amp;quot;You can teach everyone to be a great programmer&amp;quot;. And he put his money where his mouth was: He hired people with no programming experience (even with no university education) and personally trained them for &lt;i&gt;several months&lt;/i&gt;. Also, senior people in the company were encouraged to also help them and guid them.&lt;p&gt;He had to fire some of those people later, mostly because they were not a good fit for the company. But some of them became great programmers and software consultants.&lt;p&gt;&amp;quot;Hire only the best&amp;quot; is really only half of the battle. Give people an environment where learning is encouraged and failure is expected. And help them wherever you can. Most will learn and enjoy it.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>We Hire the Best, Just Like Everyone Else</title><url>http://blog.codinghorror.com/we-hire-the-best-just-like-everyone-else/</url></story>
<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>bad_user</author><text>You know what the irony is? Us programmers thinking that &amp;quot;everyone can be a great programmer&amp;quot; is our preponderant liberal and very idealistic views showing.&lt;p&gt;And we keep going around and shout that and other people believe it. And in turn we are being taken advantage of with long hours, unfair compensation for our contributions and the worse of it all? Ageism in our industry is rampant.&lt;p&gt;I look at physicians, surgeons, accountants, lawyers and others with envy, because in those professions, the older you get, the more esteemed and valuable you are. We peak at 30.</text><parent_chain><item><author>andrewstuart</author><text>&amp;quot;You can teach everyone to be a great programmer&amp;quot;&lt;p&gt;Flat out dead wrong.  If you hire &amp;quot;anyone&amp;quot; and try to teach them to be a programmer then you will probably fire them.&lt;p&gt;This is the sort of attitude that leads companies to outsource their development overseas: &amp;quot;Our programmers are people hitting keys. We&amp;#x27;ll get overseas people to hit keys and overseas people hit keys for less money.&amp;quot;, cause, you know, anyone can do it.&lt;p&gt;Programming is VERY hard and it takes a huge amount of motivation and hard work to become any good at it.  Sure you can learn how to do simple stuff without any serious interest, but to be beyond ordinary it takes enormous work and time and research and Joe Schlepp off the street is simply not going to do that.&lt;p&gt;If you want to hire people and teach them then you need to look for these things: enthusiasm for computers and programming, demonstrated willingness to learn, energy and effort.  You should value energy and effort more highly than anything. Those are the raw ingredients for trainees, and people with those ingredients are far from &amp;quot;anyone&amp;quot;.</text></item><item><author>struppi</author><text>Also: Give the &amp;quot;not-the-best&amp;quot; people a chance to develop.&lt;p&gt;The CEO of one of my past clients, a consulting company, always said: &amp;quot;You can teach everyone to be a great programmer&amp;quot;. And he put his money where his mouth was: He hired people with no programming experience (even with no university education) and personally trained them for &lt;i&gt;several months&lt;/i&gt;. Also, senior people in the company were encouraged to also help them and guid them.&lt;p&gt;He had to fire some of those people later, mostly because they were not a good fit for the company. But some of them became great programmers and software consultants.&lt;p&gt;&amp;quot;Hire only the best&amp;quot; is really only half of the battle. Give people an environment where learning is encouraged and failure is expected. And help them wherever you can. Most will learn and enjoy it.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>We Hire the Best, Just Like Everyone Else</title><url>http://blog.codinghorror.com/we-hire-the-best-just-like-everyone-else/</url></story>