<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>noodle</author><text>&amp;gt; The only reason people make apps that don&amp;#x27;t need to be apps is to get another marketing channel through App Store distribution and another user reach channel through notifications.&lt;p&gt;I wrote a longer response but decided to scrap it.  The behaviors and expectations are different than you might expect from a pure engineering POV.  Its not just sales and marketing.  For better or worse, people want to interact with companies&amp;#x27; apps on their phone via installing something &amp;quot;trusted&amp;quot; through their appropriate app store.  Not responsive mobile web, not even PWAs (which are difficult for people who are not tech savvy).&lt;p&gt;At my most recent exited startup, we had a web app which was mobile responsive.  People asked for a mobile app.  We gave them a mobile app that was simply a webview that loaded the web app.  Customers loved it.  We got almost no inbound from it at all for various reasons, but existing user satisfaction, engagement, etc went through the roof.  They could finally &amp;quot;use our app on mobile&amp;quot; even though they always could, and we consistently pointed them to the mobile web experience to do so.  This is a market full of people who are average to below average levels of tech savviness.</text><parent_chain><item><author>mrtksn</author><text>I think the negativity is well deserved because if it doesn&amp;#x27;t need device integration it doesn&amp;#x27;t need to be an app.&lt;p&gt;The device integration criterion includes achieving a full performance(be it for the UI immersiveness or processing speed).&lt;p&gt;PWA don&amp;#x27;t tick any of these, they are just an output of the dream to have universal codebase. This is a dream I share but it doesn&amp;#x27;t need to be an app in the App Store.&lt;p&gt;The only reason people make apps that don&amp;#x27;t need to be apps is to get another marketing channel through App Store distribution and another user reach channel through notifications.</text></item><item><author>samwillis</author><text>I find the negativity in this thread depressing.&lt;p&gt;The web stack (html&amp;#x2F;css&amp;#x2F;js&amp;#x2F;http) is one of the most impressive feats of invention by humanity. We have this one stack and toolkit that run on everything from a desktop computer down to a cheap (as little as 100$) mobile phone. It&amp;#x27;s free with no payments for access or deployment, and at the bottom end basic enough that a child can pick it up. But capable of building incredible professional experiences (see Figma or onShape, seriously they are incredible).&lt;p&gt;As a sole developer I can build something with a single code base for mobile (both web and installable), and desktop (again both web and installable). The breadth of tooling available is incredible.&lt;p&gt;The OP is about PWAbuilder, there are alternatives. I like the combination of Capacitor (from the Ionic Framework team) and Native Script. It lets you extent your installable version of the app with additional native capability, all while staying mostly in a JS environment.&lt;p&gt;The complaints about PWA being poor are, in my view, two fold. One, the support for them on iOS has be atrocious until recently, but also there are a lot of poorly written webapps. That is actually a testament to the accessibility of the platform.  Look past that and you see what it is truly capable of.&lt;p&gt;We need to stop this silly gate keeping, it&amp;#x27;s frankly ridiculous.&lt;p&gt;Edit: since I started writing the negative posts have them voted down the page. Looking more positive now.&lt;p&gt;Edit 2: While I have your attention, if you care about PWAs and consumer choice of web engines on mobile, go support the OWA (Open Web Advocacy - &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;open-web-advocacy.org&amp;#x2F;donate&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;open-web-advocacy.org&amp;#x2F;donate&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;). They are there to represent us and push for move choice and support. They are turning up and presenting the evidence needed to ensure the large players open up their platforms.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>PWAs in App Stores</title><url>https://web.dev/pwas-in-app-stores/</url></story>
<instructions>Your goal is to analyze the following comment and estimate how highly it will be upvoted by the Hacker News community.</instructions><comment><author>kevincox</author><text>This is the best part of PWA. Each user can do what they want.&lt;p&gt;You just want to use it on the web? Just so that. You get the full experience because there is no resource split between the web site and native apps.&lt;p&gt;You want to find the app in your favourite app store? It&amp;#x27;s there. Just install it.&lt;p&gt;You like the web version but want to add a shortcut to your app list? You can do that and there is enough metadata available to provide nice icons and titles.</text><parent_chain><item><author>mrtksn</author><text>I think the negativity is well deserved because if it doesn&amp;#x27;t need device integration it doesn&amp;#x27;t need to be an app.&lt;p&gt;The device integration criterion includes achieving a full performance(be it for the UI immersiveness or processing speed).&lt;p&gt;PWA don&amp;#x27;t tick any of these, they are just an output of the dream to have universal codebase. This is a dream I share but it doesn&amp;#x27;t need to be an app in the App Store.&lt;p&gt;The only reason people make apps that don&amp;#x27;t need to be apps is to get another marketing channel through App Store distribution and another user reach channel through notifications.</text></item><item><author>samwillis</author><text>I find the negativity in this thread depressing.&lt;p&gt;The web stack (html&amp;#x2F;css&amp;#x2F;js&amp;#x2F;http) is one of the most impressive feats of invention by humanity. We have this one stack and toolkit that run on everything from a desktop computer down to a cheap (as little as 100$) mobile phone. It&amp;#x27;s free with no payments for access or deployment, and at the bottom end basic enough that a child can pick it up. But capable of building incredible professional experiences (see Figma or onShape, seriously they are incredible).&lt;p&gt;As a sole developer I can build something with a single code base for mobile (both web and installable), and desktop (again both web and installable). The breadth of tooling available is incredible.&lt;p&gt;The OP is about PWAbuilder, there are alternatives. I like the combination of Capacitor (from the Ionic Framework team) and Native Script. It lets you extent your installable version of the app with additional native capability, all while staying mostly in a JS environment.&lt;p&gt;The complaints about PWA being poor are, in my view, two fold. One, the support for them on iOS has be atrocious until recently, but also there are a lot of poorly written webapps. That is actually a testament to the accessibility of the platform.  Look past that and you see what it is truly capable of.&lt;p&gt;We need to stop this silly gate keeping, it&amp;#x27;s frankly ridiculous.&lt;p&gt;Edit: since I started writing the negative posts have them voted down the page. Looking more positive now.&lt;p&gt;Edit 2: While I have your attention, if you care about PWAs and consumer choice of web engines on mobile, go support the OWA (Open Web Advocacy - &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;open-web-advocacy.org&amp;#x2F;donate&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;open-web-advocacy.org&amp;#x2F;donate&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;). They are there to represent us and push for move choice and support. They are turning up and presenting the evidence needed to ensure the large players open up their platforms.</text></item></parent_chain></comment><story><title>PWAs in App Stores</title><url>https://web.dev/pwas-in-app-stores/</url></story>