And I recall the meeting starting with Bill Buckingham sort of -- I'm sorry, Trudy Peterman spoke about her -- actually, hold on. Give me one second to think about this. Yes, Trudy Peterman spoke. She was the high school principal at the time. And I know that she spoke because the thing that she said seemed very similar to her graduation speech that she had said just previously.
Trudy Peterman worked with Bill Buckingham.