Well, and then what happened was, we had a conference call, Eric, Pat, several others in Pat's office and myself and Terry. They indicated that they would not. And then in the course of that conversation, the defendants counsel had stated, for example, we would like the opportunity to ask if they heard Mr. So and So say something, why didn't they write that. That's what I'm concerned about with respect to --
At least five people were involved in the conference call.