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Let them eat solar panels
5:51 pm - December 21st 2008
It was with not a little sadness and familiarity that I read Catherine Bennett's article in today's Observer, in which she vocally opposes the idea of a government bail-out for Jaguar Land Rover. It is not so much her opposition to the terms being discussed (I would support an all-out nationalisation rather than the usual cash-injection bailout that has been mooted), but rather an aspect of her reasoning, which is at issue.
There is, as most readers here will know, a long-standing fault line between green and left-wing politics, which has never been fully resolved. On the left, the vast majority of us (myself included) acknowledge the reality of environmental issues such as climate change, species decline or pollution, and we would seek political action to support these problems. Similarly, most (though not all) greens would count themselves as part of the progressive wing of politics, having long ago and rightly dispatched most of the misanthropes and population bombers who infested their movement in the 1970s. However the two movements have never fully married, for all of this apparent convergence, and periodically we see why.
Just to give one anecdotal example, I can remember attending a No Sweat gathering a couple of years ago, where an academic whose name I forget was giving a lecture on the immediacy of the climate crisis. He made, and kept returning to, the point that many of the world's industries are environmentally unsustainable and will have to change if the crisis is not to become a calamity. This point is plainly true. However I raised the "then what" question, to which he did not appear to have (or want, or indeed think it particularly important to have) an answer. What, I asked, would he suggest as an alternative mode of employment for a coal miner in West Virginia who had never known anything other than the coal industry since he was young. "Well, he'll have transferrable skills", came the answer. Like what? "Digging", the definitive answer delivered with a shrug to suppressed giggles among the assembled audience.
The point here is that whilst green politics does appeal on the left, it only appeals strongly to a certain, overwhelmingly metropolitan and middle class, section with jobs and lifestyles that can easily absorb a switch from cars to public transport, a bit of recycling and buying organic. This is fine if you are within the public sector professions, but rather harder to wear if you are an assembly line worker at Land Rover whose job has to go in order to promote the virtues espoused by others.
And this brings me back to Bennett. She is usually a humane and witty writer, however she treats the jobs and lives which would be shattered by a collapse at Jaguar Land Rover, almost as an afterthought. There are two main points where she mentions the workforce at all:
So, when assessing the plight of Jaguar Land Rover we should ask ourselves – once we've thought about all the poor workers – whether we want to live in a world without the 4.2 litre V8 petrol supercharged Jaguar which emits 299g of CO2 per kilometre
So, "once we've thought about the workers", we should get rid of the evil cars anyway, albeit with a certain nostalgic guilt about the union members now swelling the unemployment rolls. There again, maybe their livelihoods are a worthy sacrifice given what bastards Land Rover's customers tend to be. After all, what's a few unemployed car monkeys if you get to laugh at Gaunty over drinkies in Farringdon?
Which is not to say Jaguar Land Rover's workers deserve to be abandoned by the government, like the unfortunate staff of Woolworths. In the unlikely event of the brand's collapse, public money may be used, instead, to train its former workers to make sustainable vehicles: the recession's long-awaited green dividend.
Ergo, they could re-train to make Toyota Priuses, in factories that don't exist, in a region where as far as I know not one major manufacturer is planning to expand. It won't happen. They'll end up either on the dole or working in service industries for less than two thirds of what they earned in manufacturing, just like much of the ex-Rover workforce in Birmingham. Substance misuse (primarily alcohol) rises amongst manual workers when they become unemployed, as I and my overworked colleagues can attest to from the bitter experience of people who lost automotive jobs in Coventry. The consequences are devastating.
Unite, my own union and also the one most heavily organised in the automotive sector, has called for a large-scale bail-out of the car industry. For me that would have to be tied (at least) to government ownership of majority stakes in the firms which receive the cash. There would also have to be environmental targets, and longer term I would indeed advocate a change to more sustainable vehicles. However that has more to do with governmental pressure on bosses, than it does with throwing workers onto the scrapheap whilst mouthing green platitudes about how this will not be such a bad thing in the long run.
Unite's solution is far from perfect. But it is a more humane plan than that offered by "progressives" more concerned with feeling good about their own lifestyles than thinking properly about the human consequences of the policies which they advocate. Workers in the Midlands and elsewhere have suffered enough: it is time to remember who the left is there for.
Story Filed Under: Blog
1. James
So, to be clear, do you support a large-scale bail-out which leaves government money funding continued production of cars like those criticised by Catherine Bennett, cars which are not being bought in sufficient numbers to sustain the workforce but which are still contributing to climate change?
This sounds like the same Union-led green-bashing which occurs every time greens campaign for nuclear disarmament or an end to the arms trade. If we'd listened to this kind of argument I'm sure we'd still be making asbestos and mining massive amounts of coal.
It's not facile or uncaring to point to the industries where we need to be redeploying people – the kind of industries which can provide work indefinitely to large numbers of people. I'm sure most union members would rather go home at night having spent the day making solar panels and insulation rather than gas guzzlers for the boss class.
2. Alan Thomas
So how do we achieve that utopian situation? And who's "we" anyway?
Incidentally no, I don't think that car workers who were told – and believed – that they had secure employment are sat at home thinking "I'd love to make solar panels", and neither do I think that car workers are the same as nuclear industry advocates.
My point isn't to disagree with the environmental imperatives about reducing emissions – I think I make that clear – it's that greens need to come up with some answer to the "what about after that" question which actually addresses the question of what happens to the lives of the people whose lives will be turned upside down by the solutions currently on offer. Furthermore, there needs to be some kind of governmental mechanism for delivering it. "Jon Gaunt and Zara Phillips are bastards and they drive Land Rovers" doesn't seal the deal for me, and it won't for those having to live off £60.50/week JSA either.
I take it you've seen the Green New Deal being promoted by my colleagues in England and Wales?
http://www.neweconomics.org/gen/greennewdealneededforuk210708.aspx
What do you make of it?
Potentially promising – what I would want to see are some real guarantees to people who work in sectors that are already under threat (like automotive) that they will not lose their livelihoods, and to people who are on low wages that they won't be punished by having to pay inflated prices for basics such as food and clothes. I guess we'll just have to see that they come up with and then I'll make a judgement.
5. Conor Foley
Yeah but Alan there is a company in the West Midlands that makes leg-irons which were used to torture prisoners in Saudi Arabia. When I was working at Amnesty International we campaigned for a tighter ban on the export of goods that could be used to torture people. I remember having a debate at a Young Fabian conference when someone (I think it was Luke Akehurst, but not certain) made exactly the same point that you have just done – what would happen to the poor workers currently employed to make the leg-irons?
Secondly, how far would you extend your logic about what workers should be supported to make and how much support do you think that British car-making workers deserve against, say, Brazilian car-making workers who can produce a cheaper product? There aren't many alternatives to the car industry in Sao Bernado, why should its products be locked out of western markets?
Incidentally, I had to wait for two hours to be able to post my article just below yours because we were suffering yet another power cut in Brazil. These are very regular occurences because we do not have enough sources of electricity supply – a problem that most developing countries face. There is always going to be a debate between the trade offs between economic growth and environmental sustainability (you give the example of keeping people in unproductive jobs or making them re-train, I could give you much more basic examples of the choices people face when they go to bed hungry every night). So you explain to me why we should not cut down the whole of the Amazon rain forest as fast as possible and screw what it does to the environment?
Conor, you're a journalist and I work with the mentally unwell ex-homeless. I'm guessing that neither of us will struggle for work through the recession – unfortunately that isn't true of many people in the West Midlands and that is where I live. Forgive me for asking questions of the great and the good amongst the chatterati about whether these people are actually just expendable numbers in a greater cause.
Look, whatever Luke Akehurst may have said about the manufacturers of shackles, there is a serious issue here as to what the strategy is for dealing with car workers, their families and the social consequences of the mass unemployment that is visible to all and affecting the entire economy in this region. I hardly think that asking "what about after we've done that?" is unreasonable when very grand and sweeping statements are made about what is good for the country and the world as a whole. The world is made up of people, and some of them will suffer (indeed have suffered) through the collapse of the car industry. Unless we address that, I fail to see how we justify the "left" bit of "liberal-left".
PS – take a plane to Brazil did we? 😉
8. Mike Killingworth
The brute fact that no one wants to say openly is that our standard of living is going to fall off a cliff – probably down to what it was in the 1930s.
There is no historical precedent for this kind of decline being well-managed. It means that almost of all of us have based our lives- economically – on what have turned out to be false assumptions.
Those who think, as I do, that the gap between rich and poor in Britain is too wide ain't seen nothing yet.
We shall be very lucky indeed to escape major social disorder and/or the imposition of an authoritarian government fronted up by a plausible clown (and, yes, Boris does come to mind for that role). We pretend not to notice how many of our dearest values are actively hated elsewhere in the world by people who see them as socially destructive, whether political freedom by the Chinese, or romantic love by the traditional Muslim paterfamilias. They don't regard the hegemony of Western culture as God-given and at the very least will lose no sleep over our collapse.
And yes, the car workers in the Midlands face a life of squalour, degradation and misery. As, probably, do most of the rest of us. All our politics, left and right alike, is based on the pursuit of economic growth. And that phase of Western history – what Galbraith called the "liberal hour" – is over.
"Our" standard of living wasn't universal in the 1930s though, was it Mike? I'm pretty sure that Lord Halifax, Churchill and George VI weren't living in the East London slums.
10. Sue Luxton
What is UNITE's position on the Heathrow expansion and airport expansion elsewhere?
Sue; I'm not entirely sure whether there's an actual policy although certainly in 2007 the Amicus section published an article on their website supporting it. I have to admit that I don't know what view the TGWU section (of which I'm a member) takes.
"Unless we address that, I fail to see how we justify the "left" bit of "liberal-left"."
Why bail out the automotive industry? It seems like you're advocating the funding of a middle man here and surely we can…in the "left" perspective…be a bit more efficient with our bail outs? A bail out for Jaguar, a particularly poorly performing brand in a poorly performing market, would end up pumping money in to what? At best paying workers wages during a period of poor sales, at worst in to other business costs.
Surely the most efficient thing is to invest directly in the people should Jaguar fail? the £1bn touted would give the 15k workers at Jaguar probably two years salary on average, maybe more….or more importantly would be a much more efficient way of reaching the balance with green credentials of retraining them for work in a similar albeit different industry, on full pay, within a year.
Propping up the banks was important given the level of savings involved and how much a collapse would have cost us all in sorting that situation out, but propping up failing businesses for the sake of their workers is giving failing businesses too much of a safety net using it's workers as an excuse. Help the workers, ensure that the people that are in ownership of the business aren't going to fall in to a situation of poverty (as long as their assets are also used in such calculations), but let's not prop up those businesses that can't sustain themselves…especially since there are plenty of other businesses closing down (MFI, Woolworths, do we even want to count small businesses?) that are closing down with plenty of job losses on the horizon.
the £1bn touted would give the 15k workers at Jaguar probably two years salary on average, maybe more….or more importantly would be a much more efficient way of reaching the balance with green credentials of retraining them for work in a similar albeit different industry, on full pay, within a year.
Sounds like the beginnings of an answer to me, Lee. All we then have to do is ensure that those alternative industries for which the people are being trained, are there and ready to take them on.
14. Jennie Rigg
Could a bail out not be made contingent upon research into greener technology? Or am I being needlessly Utopian?
15. Neil
Interesting argument, Lee. One problem, however, is that a bailout wouldn't just help those working in the car manufacturing, but the people and companies who are reliant on their business, which stretches all the way from haulage companies and parts manufacturers right down to sandwich shops. Would they be eligible for state money as well? And if so, how would the government assess each claim?
I completely agree, however, with the need (should it arise) to provide sufficient help & retraining to these people in the event a bailout can't guarantee the companies' long-term future. We failed to do that in the 1980's, and it's brought us nowt but trouble.
Jennie; sounds a good move.
Aye, Neil, but then in all honesty that itself is part of a bigger issue is it not? If the car firms are failing then the businesses that rely on them are, at some point, going to have to consider their business model. They can't exactly claim ignorance on the issue, that's just bad business sense.
If a bailout could be achieved that essentially pushed Jaguar to evolve, and quickly, then I don't think there is a problem there either, but I'm very much against the idea of just saving businesses nationally that have managed themselves in to failure, when the people that really need the help are the workers that are disadvantaged by their managers poor business models. Especially since there is no guarantee that if the business still goes tits up that those workers will be at all helped in the mid to long term.
To clarify on "the larger issue". If Jaguar fails then other companies such as Haulage companies, parts manafacturers, sandwich shops, marketing companies…they all lose business. In doing so, assuming absolutely no disaster planning, forward thinking or business flexibility, some of these businesses end up shutting down, or shedding workers.
That in turn affects retailers on the high street, perhaps the telecoms and internet business…enough people made unemployed there and the effects can domino. Thankfully most business areas adapt and survive, assuming there is the market need for them to do so, and while jobs could be lost in one area and perhaps businesses closed, the change in market share means new jobs in those that survive.
If the car industry is facing such a problem (which we know they are, they have been for long enough now) that companies shutting down means that no market share is being transfered, that's a whole seperate issue…hauliers, parts manafacturers….if they can't survive the knock on effect then they (or their workers) in turn need their own support.
We simply can't be proping up markets through the state that are unsustainable, in the short term it might save some jobs and make people happy, but it only postpones the inevitable, and without the evolution of industry being accepted and the investment in people that has to come along with that, it's just leading to bigger problems down the line.
Seems perfectly sensible, Lee. I've written elsewhere about being reluctantly in favour of the bailout in the States, primarily because the political & economic conditions in that country makes it impossible to implement a satisfactory alternative until the new administration can get its feet under the table.
In Britain we at least have the ability to pick the least worst course of action, and whilst my preference is still to save Jaguar Land Rover (albeit with heavy strings attached), I'm not going advocate the state sustaining it in the short-term if they can't prove able to sustain themselves in the medium/long-term. If that's the case, then, as you've already said, the money would be better spent elsewhere. My only demand is that we start doing better by the ever-increasing numbers of unemployed than the department of James Purnell seems equipped to do.
Much of my angst about this comes from the stories I heard whilst growing up about family members who suffered real economic and mental hardship when the pits closed. Whilst the area's economy has rejuvenated to a degree, the scars in those communities still haven't completely healed over two decades later, and I'd hate to see working class people in the Midlands – or anywhere else – suffer the same fate.
20. Conor Foley
What Lee said in overall terms.
The problem I have with the original article is I don't get the point of the argument. Are you complaining about Bennet saying that working class factory workers should not get an industry bail-out because you disagree with her argument or just because she is a middle class journalist who lives in London – and therefore has no right to say such things?
I agree with your overall point about the left being more socially aware than the greens (and have taken issue with George Monbiot's call for a boycott of Brazilian beef and the Guardian's knee-jerk opposition to Brazilian ethanol on the same basis), but is your argument that the government should prop up the British car-industry as a form of social welfare or what?
My question back to you is what is the 'social good' of the British car industry apart from the employment it provides? I can see why the British government should invest in skills and training of its workforce, or the knowledge economy, or green technologies or other socially useful things, but what is it about the British car industry (nationalised or otherwise) that you think particularly deserves support?
21. Rayyan
"greens need to come up with some answer to the "what about after that" question which actually addresses the question of what happens to the lives of the people whose lives will be turned upside down by the solutions currently on offer"
I agree with this 110% – I've blogged about the Green Party needing to speak to the everyday concerns of people, beyond the advocacy of big bold brushstrokes of policy that it as a party is not exactly in a position to enact at present:
http://rayyanmirza.wordpress.com/2008/12/11/the-green-party-lacks-a-core-message/
Conor;
Conor, I diametrically disagree with Bennett in that I support full government control of Jag Land Rover, with heavy (green) strings attached. She on the other hand appears to think that it's OK if they fall by the wayside because the cars are gas guzzlers, the owner is a profiteer (show me a businessman who is motivated by anything else), and because certain celebrity customers of theirs are obnoxious. Then, as an afterthought, she adds "oh we need to consider the workers, maybe we could re-train them". It isn't good enough from someone of progressive politics, and yes I think it would look different if she lived in Aston.
Frankly, the problem isn't that Bennett is a middle class journalist (the phrase, whilst not quite tautological, fits more national opinion columnists than not), it is that it's a lot easier to look upon several thousand real people as mere numbers to be junked in a greater cause if one never has to see them in the flesh. Further, it's a lot easier to see removing their means of employment as an almost virtuous cause if their unemployment will never affect one directly, and if one's main concern is with a choice, rather than an imperative, to take an interest in labour movement politics. I believe that's what is skewing Bennett's perspective, and I also believe that is what skews the perspective of many, many middle class liberals and leftists on questions like this one.
PS (sorry I keep doing this)
In answer to your question, cars get people to work. The industry itself provides employment to people as you say, and in doing so puts money into other areas of the West Mids economy. In and of itself, virtually no private sector business has a "social worth". What's the social worth of travel agents? Of recruitment consultants? Financial advisors? Futures speculators? Hedge funds? Opinion columnists? "Social Worth" of the industry really isn't the point – if it were, most of us would be unemployed.
24. Rob Knight
I'm not sure that I like the idea of a bailout of the car industry, for the simple reason that it seems like an arbitrary decision rather than an expression of a universal principle. Why the car industry and not others? Why now when other bailouts have failed to secure long-term viability (Rover)? If the fundamental problem with people making Jaguar cars is that the rest of us would rather that they didn't (which we express by not buying the cars), any solution which involves them carrying on making them anyway seems to have a fairly fundamental problem.
In the original post, Alan wrote:
…the jobs and lives which would be shattered by a collapse at Jaguar Land Rover…
The problem here is the equation of jobs with lives. The scale of the economic pain that can be inflicted on a community by the collapse of a single employer is effectively being used by that employer to hold those lives to ransom, with the rest of us being forced to pay up unless we want to see a lot of people get hurt, with knock-on social effects as described in the original post. Most decent people don't want to see that happen, and in any case we have some self-interest in preventing another community falling into a pattern of dysfunction, perpetual unemployment and worse.
But surely paying the ransom to the employers isn't the answer here? If this were a unique crisis, it might be worth considering doing just that, but industries disappear all the time and for perfectly valid reasons (I consider the move away from cars to be a perfectly valid reason for the car industry to shut up shop and will not shed any tears over it). Surely there's a way out of this kind of cycle of sudden demands for extra cash 'or else'? And if we decide to protect the car industry, we're still left with the problem of why we do not extend the same protection to companies with less vocal workforces.
Basically, I think that if the car industry can't sustain itself then it should go. We need the resources for other things. The questions are then a) how to help those who lose out find alternative employment, and this is somewhere where I think that we can afford to be a lot more generous than we have in the past and b) how we can, perhaps, try to favour economic arrangements where such a level of dependency on a single employer doesn't arise in the first place. Sadly, those are questions to which I don't have a great answer, but both feel more likely to result in a good answer than the question of how to structure a bailout of the car industry.
Rob; replace "car" with "coal" and your argument could have come from a Thatcherite circa 1983. Replace it with "banking" and change the date to 2008 however, and…
Yep, I agree. Thatcherites are a pretty inconsistent bunch. Was that your point?
I think you might have been trying to say that, since Thatcherites were in favour of letting the mining industry wind down in the 1980s, anyone who is now in favour of letting the same thing happen to the car industry must therefore be a Thatcherite. And, since we've already established that Thatcherites are cunts, that's not a thing that anyone here would want to be.
And nor, for that matter, do I. I just think that it's deeply regrettable that we're in a position where we've got thousands of people whose only option for employment is working doing something that nobody else wants them to do and, when the money to pay for this runs out, the government has to step in to prop it up or face a social calamity in the affected communities. That's being stuck between a rock and a hard place, and I can't believe that it's beyond us to think of a better long-term solution.
Thatcherites assumed that market magic would lead to the creation of new jobs and industries in communities where the previous employers vanished (and they even decided to test this theory on the toughest case of all, the mining communities where there really was just one employer and no other economic resources to build on). Blairites assumed that 'education, education, education' was the key, and that people who lost manufacturing jobs could just get a few NVQs in graphic design or something. Both got it wrong, but there is still a question that we can't hide from: what do we do when industries decline? There has to be a way of letting obsolete industries die their natural death without this being a gigantic blight on the lives of those who, at the moment this happens, happen to be employed by the industry. It seems to me, as an admitted outsider to manufacturing, that the problem is the sheer lack of options faced by people in this position. I'd rather focus on improving the position of these people than propping up their employers.
I'm somewhat with Lee and Conor here – in that one would have to assess the impact on the industry and weigh it up with the futility of propping up a inefficient car manufacturer.
Saying that, I don't know why this scenario is even being discussed. Jaguar is owned by Tata now – which isn't in any danger of going bust. Ford used to own it, but its position is also more secure than GM or Chrysler – which are perhaps the best examples of economic mismanagement and deserve to fail.
The broader fault-lines are there – and I do believe that to a certain extent both considerations: of the environment and that of local jobs, need to be taken into account. This isn't a tension that will be resolved easily – though Obama has navigated it well by focusing on creating 'green jobs' and saying the bailout of the auto manufacturers in the US would have to be accompanied by more stress on green economies.
Our govt pays some basic lip service to green issues, and thus would never ask such a thing.
"The problem here is the equation of jobs with lives. The scale of the economic pain that can be inflicted on a community by the collapse of a single employer is effectively being used by that employer to hold those lives to ransom"
What I find interesting about all this is that realistically there are people in the industry that are talking in much more socialist terms. They aren't calling for bailouts for individual companies, they are asking for the government to act in a way that will restart the consumer buying of new cars. It's probably less realistic than what's being talked about here, but it's important to note that they aren't just putting the begging bowl out and expecting a hand out; not all of them at least.
29. dreamingspire
First, this morning's news is that Tata has been able to secure other financial support for the short term.
Next, never mind the Jags, think about the Land Rovers – govt buys them, and they have an export market. (Govt buys Jags, too, but other makes could and do equally well form the basis for armoured limos.).
But also the market for cars in developed countries is never again going to be as big as recently, so think about a diversion of skills into green energy equipment. With our maritime climate we tend to see solar panel installations and household energy recovery systems as indulgences, and thus the small market for them makes them very expensive (and advertising that I have received recently completely fails to give me facts on the financial case, so it went straight in the recycling). Coupled with strong controls on the quality of installation work (and National Grid getting to grips with coping with all those tiny generating plants wanting to sell into the Grid, and the electricity generating companies building pumped storage installations), we should now use transfer engineering skills to benefit nearly everyone.
30. asquith
Yes, but the old heavy industries were unsustainable economically & environmentally. If these car companies are making products people don't want to buy, it's most likely a failure of management, so why pay them to repeat their idiocy?
In large part, the pain of the 80s was a result of the mistakes of the postwar years in having an economy overreliant on certain industries & mistrustful of innovation. The problem now is with short-termism & failure to invest in research & development. You've gone from postwar stupidity to Blatcherite stupidity without an interlude of sense.
Obama has realised this, & sees the opportunities greening can genuinely provide. There are more than enough entrepeneurs willing to make sustainable products, & hopefully those being shed from the City of London (which was always overblown, especially by the Labour cunts) will start doing something useful in this field.
If there are people who are only good at making cars & nothing else, & if there are whole towns reliant on a single employer, that is a culture which needs to be confronted head-on. This was partly done in the 1980s but not properly. A more diverse economy would be more genuinely resilient.
I fear that the failures of the City & the ridiculous reliance on house prices & debt have left us naked. But it is a sign that things must change, & in this there is an opportunity if government & managers can stop being so utterly shite.
Lest anyone think otherwise, I would like to see a revival of manufacturing, & we suffer from a lack of it, as even fuckwits like Mandelson now realise. But it is a terrible mistake to engage in business as usual. I said the same about the VAT cut, which idea & the "thinking" behind it was flayed alive on these pages & elsewhere.
I used to work in a factory in the summers, & it is a respectable & decent job to be doing. It is vastly preferable to the sheds (oh, sorry, "distribution centres") that are mushrooming in this city.
Alan: and if you argued that 'travel agents, recruitment consultants, Financial advisors, Futures speculators Hedge funds, and Opinion columnists' should be receiving government subsidies I would ask the same question. In fact the banks have just received a massive financial subsidy (they have been nationalised) and that is one of the questions I take up on my own piece below.
I bought a car because I need it to get around in Brasilia where there is no public transport. I caught a plane to travel from Georgia to Brazil because the alternative (boat and rail) was impractical. These were commercial decisions that I made and the only government involvement was to tax the transactions and regulate the activities of the companies (and a good thing too).
Of course I get the point that you thought Bennet's article was a bit too smug and snearing and if you were a car worker – rather than just someone who lives near my big sister in Brum – you would have a valid complaint. But I think Bennet's argument was basically legitimate (and I also think that Brazilian landless workers should be prevented from cutting down the Amazon rainforest)
Major problems with environmentally friendly energy generation are often engineering in nature e,g
1. Corrosion of bearings by sea water in wave powered electrical generation systems.
2. Low frequency signals driving away animals – a potential adverse impact on fishing by offshore wind powered electrical generation stations.
3. How to distribute electrical power from wind farms on the western and northern side of the UK.
All these will require highly skilled craftsmen, technicians, scientists and engineers- the type of person employed by high quality car manufacturers.
Over the last 65 yrs there has been a disasterous decline in the number of technically skilled people in the UK due to the unions, employers, civil servants and politicians. Those who are left are too valuable too lose.
Personally I would close down all humanity courses in the bottom 70 universites and use the money on scientific and engineering training. We need to return to the old polytechnic system where craftsmen can study for technical degrees in the evenings and weekends at colleges close to home. The UK will need to achieve the same level of technical advance as we did between 1938 and 1945 over the next 10 years. If we look at our successes;- Radar, Hawker Hurricane, Spitfire, Bouncing Bomb and Ten Ton Bombs,Mosquito,Wellington Bomber ,defeating magnetic mines, Lancaster Bomber, airborne navigation,cracking of ENIGMA and building of Colossus, Mulberry Harbours for DDay, Pluto – underwater fuel pipes, all the speciallist tanks designed to overcome obstacles on the beaches on Normandy, Bailey Bridges etc then we have done it in the past. However, we will have to be ruthless in removing non-technical training from the national budget. We cannot have the situation where teaching maths and further maths , physics, chemistry, biology and geology at A level becomes the preserve of the private and grammar schools.
The technical skills in the West Midlands can be the base for a green future in the UK; it will not be achieved by those with an education in the humanities .
34. Matt Munro
"The point here is that whilst green politics does appeal on the left, it only appeals strongly to a certain, overwhelmingly metropolitan and middle class, section with jobs and lifestyles that can easily absorb a switch from cars to public transport, a bit of recycling and buying organic."
This has always been my main problem with the green movement. I would in fact go further and say that even the metrpolitian middle class OUTSIDE LONDON cannot easily change to a "green" lifestyle – public transport expensive/rubbish, schools some distance from home/work.
In Bristol, where I live, the only greens tend to be 20/30 somethings with no kids who live and work near the city centre, doing regular hours in the same office 5 days a week. Obviously it's easy for them to ride a bike/get the bus, and car ownership becomes an uneccesary luxury.
Once you are older, a parent and/or have a more responsible job it becomes impossible with irregular work hours/locations, the school run, synchorinsing the working day with a childminder/your partners etc etc. It just cannot physically be done with the current infrastructure.
"Personally I would close down all humanity courses in the bottom 70 universites and use the money on scientific and engineering training."
Now that would strike a blow against the SWP from which they would never recover!
36. Andreas Paterson
Personally, I have a problem talking about "inefficient and unsustainable industries" because it smacks of the Thatcherite worldview that believes that when a business goes down the market will act in such a way that new economic activity will replace the lost activity from the failed business. There are examples where this didn't happen, when some developing companies dropped their trade barriers the farmers who were undercut by subsidised western imports were driven out of business, in subsequent years the market didn't kick in and create any kind of new economic activity.
In terms of Jaguar and Land Rover their failure isn't really down to not anticipating the green revolution but the extraordinary economic situation we're now in. The thing about the company as it stands is that a) it provides good, well paid jobs and b) it brings together a lot of expertise and infrastructure relating to car production that could potentially be used to take the company in a future green direction.
I personally believe that Jaguar's current woes are temporary and that with appropriate support and investment it could become a sustainable future business.
37. Alix
"Personally, I have a problem talking about "inefficient and unsustainable industries" because it smacks of the Thatcherite worldview"
This is daft. As you rightly imply, the Thatcherite worldview was flawed in two important ways (1) it artifically closed down individual businesses that were still, or had the potential to be, profitable and (2) it assumed the system would automatically pick up the slack in unemployment, despite the bleeding obvious square peg/round hole problems involved in throwing a manufacturing workforce at a burgeoning service economy.
If someone talks about "unsustainable industries" but then doesn't then go on to say that therefore everything in the industry should be shut down regardless of individual circumstances and all the workers will be able to instantly get jobs as advertising execs then… well, they haven't said it, have they. So what's your problem? You might as well have a problem with people using the word "the" because it smacks of a Thatcherite world view. To deny that some industries may turn out to be unsustainable in pure business terms is ludicrous. How you decide to approach that reality – in terms of provision for workers etc – is surely more to the point.
Alix, apologies, it was my sloppy hastily constructed english. The intended target was those who use such words in the "let them go bust" sense, which seemed to be the thrust of the Catherine Bennett article.
So, Andreas, do you not accept that some businesses (on an individual level) just don't get their model right, or exist in a shrinking market, to such a degree that they have no opportunity to survive with radical change?
Amazing thread. You all agree that government needs to spend other people's money to pay people to produce stuff that people don't want to buy and really DON'T need, and you think this should all be done for progressive ends. But you can't agree which progressive ends: to save the world or to save jobs!
The green problem doesn't really need a solution because it isn't a real problem at all. The environment is important to people but we can deal with it just as soon as everyone agrees its important (when everyone is rich enough not to care about other things). The problem of people's jobs becoming obsolete is much tougher. More people than ever have transferable skills and with smaller businesses and more self-employed individuals, we are seeing economic forms that are more immune to sudden changes develop.
But what about those that have yet to be opted in to such a scheme or lack the necessary potential to be so adaptable? I am not so sure. I know the European model of greater union/corporation co-operation has worked well where workers are damn near guaranteed a job for the whole of their lives but not necessarily THAT job, and corporations take on responsiblities to maintain their workers – if necessary paying to have them re-skilled for another line of work. I am sure some of these things could develop here if we weren't so antagonistic when it comes to labour/business relations. But how to get from here to there is a difficult question.
Actually no, I have a "valid" complaint because I'm right about this IMO, and that would still be true whether I was a Jag assembly line worker or a surfer on a beach in California. These people are members of my own trade union and I seem to recall some concept called "solidarity" upon which the labour movement in this country was founded. Furthermore, I notice that none of the people who are so willing to say "sorry but they have to go to the wall" (as I understand it, it's the "sorry" bit which makes one not a Thatcherite) appear to be car workers themselves. I don't think that invalidates their right to comment about this, and nor does the fact that the London politico/media/NGO circuit is unlikely to be hard-hit by a further collapse in the West Mids economy. Although mind you, it does lead me to question whether the human aspect of the whole thing has properly been appreciated.
A few general points. As I said, I'm not in favour of simply chucking money at failing private firms. Indeed with the motor industry, more could be done by taking it into public owenership and then dealing properly with the environmental issues caused by Jaguar/Land Rover vehicles. Letting the firm go to the wall and creating economic devastation as a result is not a particularly "green solution", in fact it is one of which the American Enterprise Institute or the Cato Foundation would heartily approve. It is also a cruel and unfeeling one, in my view.
Further, it always amazes me the way that people seem to believe that the magical capacity of "training" to produce new jobs out of dust. Bennett appears to think this in her original article, and it's been mentioned several times in the course of this thread. The reality is that training prepares people for jobs that are already there, and if a region collapses economically then all of its residents could be qualified to PhD level without a single one necessarily becoming unemployed.
Alan: forgive me if I was slightly teasing your physical and emotional connection to the toiling masses on car plant assembly lines – it is only relevant in as much as you dwell on Catherine Bennet's social origins. But, assuming for a moment that you did nationalise the British car industry, how would you persuade people to buy cars which they can get cheaper elsewhere? Look at the Nano car that the Indians are building. How is the west going to compete with that and should we be doing so by going "up market" to produce gas-guzzlers?
The problems of the west midlands car industry are similar to the problems facing Detroit. George Monbiot wrote a piece about this, (which was far harsher than Bennet's) and it is easy enough to slam them both for being middle class greenies, etc. but how do you deal with their substantve argument?
As Larry Elliot said in yesterday's Guardian "there needs to be a vision of the good society, the world the left wants to create. The free-market right has one. The Marxists have one. The greens have one. Unless the social democratic left has one – and can articulate it fully – it is finished."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/dec/22/keynes-left-economics-economy
Lee – Please don't think you were the intended target of my first comment, I'd only skimmed the comments when I wrote the original comment, in answer to your question: I think that government should consider intervening in businesses that are viable in the long term (I'll admit this can be a bit subjective), I think that given mass produced fuel cell cars are now a reality a green car industry is very much a reality for the future and that it's worth Britain having a piece of the action.
On training, I agree with Alan in that jobs don't always create themselves. Entepreneurs in Britain have a bias towards retail and services businesses and against industry. More generally I think the government should act to counter that balance.
Nick – A huge swathe of the economy is devoted to producing things we don't need but someone wants, As far as spending other people's money goes, state intervention has been incredibly effective in kickstarting economic development in the past. A reform of union/employer relations could also be useful as well as a reform of the banking system.
For those not so sure on the benefits of state intervention, I'd advise them to take a look at the work of Professor Ha-Joon Chang he's written extensively on the subject and although much of what he writes is more centered on developing nations, there are some elements of his work that could be applied to advanced economies.
Andreas – I am hearing more and more about this guy, the new guru of state intervention: http://freebornjohn.blogspot.com/2008/12/cargo-cult-economics.html
Obviously such a large body of work deserves more examination but if the above ripping apart of that Prospect article is anything to go by, he relies on very skewed readings of history to derive these 'benefits' from state intervention.
I am not saying there is anything wrong with having an economy that makes things people want. I am saying there is a problem with economies that make stuff people don't want or need at all! The idea that state internvention can ever kick-start an econony is a weird notion in theory, and doesn't seem to have ever worked in practice: http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2008/12/15/are-we-all-keynesians-now/
So far a lot of the discussion has focused on making cars, I think it's safe to say that there will be future demand for them. I don't think there's been much discussion on other goods. I personally don't advocate the idea of producing something that no one wants.
Chang's actual position is more nuanced than the article I linked to makes out, the article in question was intended to promote his book "Bad Samaritans" which is intended to present his ideas in an acessible way.
He is not 100% opposed to economic liberalisation, although he does appear (from what I've read of his work) to disapprove of some elements of it. He does advocate protectionism for developing nations although he believes such policies should be implemented in the context of an overall development strategy. I'll try and write a little more on his work when I get a moment.
I think that Chang's ideas might well have a role to play too, particularly in understanding the risks of 'liberalisation' to developing countries under our current 'neo-liberal' market institutions which often act as an ideological cover for state appropriation and extortion of local communities. The emphasis that the neo-liberal order places on intellectual property (a very mixed blessing even in the best circumstances) is damn near unconscionable when it comes to enforcing such laws on the developing world. In those sort of circumstances, protectionism (which really just constitutes self-defence against the unlawful actions of Western corporations) might well be justified.
But for all that, I don't think those criticisms touch trade liberalisation as such, merely emphasise the fundamental importance of having real property rights, the rule of law and equality before the law in place, rather than the skewed priorities of what Western transnational organisation have decended free markets and capitalism are about.
Sorry – that last sentence was terribly written (I shouldn't really be commenting while so groggy):
"But for all that, I don't think those criticisms touch trade liberalisation as such, merely emphasise the fundamental importance of having real property rights, the rule of law and equality before the law in place, rather than the skewed priorities of what Western transnational organisations have decided free markets and capitalism are about."
"You all agree that government needs to spend other people's money to pay people to produce stuff that people don't want to buy and really DON'T need"
No we don't, that's pretty much the crux of the whole debate here.
Lee – Correct me if I am being a bit simplistic here but your plans also appear to involve the government deploying cash. You just want it to reach the workers via a different method. But the options a government has are pretty limited. You can pay them to carry on producing stuff that people won't buy, you can pay them NOT to produce stuff that people don't want to buy which merely fuels dependency and doesn't really avoid the problem – you are just paying people to produce nothing rather than something.
Or you can invest it in such a way that the workers can get new jobs. But government is pretty poor at making those sort of investment decisions. If it happens upon a solution (whether it was a certain sort of re-retraining or inventing a new product to make and sell), it would be pretty much by random chance. At the same time, the cost of the government's actions would have to be taken from somewhere – either from higher taxes now or through a debt which will inhibit recovery because people will be worried about tax increases in the future.
So the best option might be to do much less rather than more. Reduce corporate taxes and/or taxes on low incomes – or at the very least stop spending so much now so that people are less anxious about future tax increase. That way the economy has a better chance of recovery and taking advantage of the labour on offer. Or if you really want to nudge it in favour of those being laid off right now, reduce taxes in a more limited way in the form of a tax credit on training for new workers (r something along those lines). That way you can allow successful firms to co-ordinate the recovery without direct government intervention. The last thing you want is the government itself deciding where the money ought to go. It is more likely to sink it in a useless make-work scheme than something productive for the long term.
"Lee – Correct me if I am being a bit simplistic here but your plans also appear to involve the government deploying cash. You just want it to reach the workers via a different method."
You're being simplistic. One argument is that the government should pay cash to businesses that are failing to help workers…with a bit of an angle potentially on that business being long term viable…while the other argument is that the business is failing, but that shouldn't meant the workers just get made redundant (we think it's bad for society and the economy) and instead should get aid to help them in to a new industry. It's two different arguments. The latter doesn't keep the business propped up whatsoever, it's just stops workers being the worst affected by management and business strategy screw ups.
Once again, all the possibilities you describe involve the government doing something – therefore spending cash that might otherwise be put to better use in the market – or under present circumstances not spent at all so that our longterm debts don't become the cause of genuinely viable businesses failing in the future.
52. Andrew Hickey
Yes, Nick. They do involve the government doing something. Some of us think that when thousands of people are going to be thrust into poverty, through no fault of their own, and when this is entirely avoidable with a relatively small amount of government spending, then avoiding it is exactly the kind of thing a government *should* do – the principal question being not whether it should be avoided but what method does the most good…
What there is *no* question of is no money being spent – unless you think perhaps we should stop paying unemployment benefits to those people? The question is whether it's better to spend quite a lot of money now, short term, to allow those people to continue to be productive but in different industries, to spend the same amount of money to allow them to keep their jobs in a failing industry for an indefinite length of time, or to spend slightly less right now, but keep spending indefinitely, paying unemployment benefit (and additional spending on healthcare, income support for them when they reach pensionable age as they will have no savings, etc etc) for the same people.
Even discounting the horrific human cost of that much unemployment, even discounting the knock-on economic effects of entire communities losing their main employers, just on a pure cost-benefit analysis it makes sense for the government to do a little more now…
No, the possibility I describe means the government doing something to secure the quality of life for people that are made redundent in a failing market with no possibility to upskill or reskill themselves without getting further in to debt in a poor economic environment. It has nothing to do with whether the business itself fails or not, it's to do with ensuring that where businesses do fail, *people* are protected in the short term from falling in to a cycle of welfare and desperation.
But Andrew – why should it be the government that does this? The money has to come from somewhere and that somewhere will probably better co-ordinate a response than government. Hell, if you doubt the ability of for-profit companies to create work for willing employees in the current climate, then why not address the problem yourself with your own money and (if you have time) your own ideas. Ask the government to leave more money with you and the rest of us and you can choose where to apply it – whether it is buying more things you want or investing it where you think it is worthwhile either charitably or commercially. Trust me, your choices will be much more likely to work than what the government comes up with. Doing good is not a government monopoly.
In the current climate, are companies really going to throw money at reskilling people?
Well we'll never know will we, while current incomes are being hoovered up by the government and future incomes mortgaged against higher taxes in the future. Of course, the chances of companies 'throwing' money at anything is somewhat less than government, that is why it is best to leave as much money as possible with them and us!
57. Luke Akehurst
Just for the record I have never expressed or held the view that Conor Foley ascribes to me in comment number 5 above. In fact I have never debated against Conor in public.
Trying to compare the manufacture of cars to the manufacture of torture equipment is really fairly odd.
Linkblogging for 22/12/08 « Sci-Ence! Justice Leak!
[…] good conversation is going on in this post and its comments at Liberal Conspiracy, on the tension between green and left-wing views. I […]
Why I Am Not A Libertarian « Sci-Ence! Justice Leak!
[…] in their thinking, both of which are summed up by some recent comments by 'Nick' in this thread on Liberal Conspiracy (scroll […]


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Oak Park electoral board rules trustee candidate Enyia can remain on ballot, continues Clark hearing
By Steve Schering
An Oak Park electoral board ruled Jan. 12 that village trustee candidate Chibuike Enyia can remain on the April 2021 ballot. Enyia's candidacy was challenged by resident Kevin Peppard. (Chibuike Enyia)
After a citizen filed objections to the candidacies of two Oak Park village trustee candidates, an Oak Park electoral board has ruled that one candidate can remain on the April ballot, while a case against a second candidate could conclude as soon as next week.
The board, made up of Mayor Anan Abu-Taleb, village trustee Jim Taglia and village clerk Vicki Scaman, voted 3-0 on Jan. 12 to allow trustee candidate Chibuike Enyia to remain on the ballot.
Enyia's candidacy was challenged by resident Kevin Peppard, who claimed the candidate had a felony on his record, which made him ineligible to hold a municipal office in Illinois.
. "I think what's clear in the record here is just because someone is on probation doesn't mean they've been convicted of a crime," Enyia's attorney Ed Mullen said.
The issue stems from a drug arrest made in Iowa more than a decade ago, Mullen said.
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"He entered into a plea agreement and conviction would only be entered if he didn't complete his probation or pay his fine," Mullen said. "I think the law is pretty clear on this."
Peppard said the issue was a "legal matter," in which he felt the charge was enough to keep Enyia off the ballot.
Electoral board members felt there was not sufficient evidence to support Peppard's allegations, ruling he can remain on the ballot.
"I would say it doesn't appear to me that there's proof that a felony conviction was entered in the first place," Taglia said. "I think that's important. I don't think that burden has been met, based on what I see."
After the ruling, the electoral board announced it will meet again Jan. 14 to formally approve the decision.
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"I encourage Mr. Enyia to pursue a vigorous campaign and I appreciate the work he has done in mentoring youth in recent years," Peppard said.
Peppard is also challenging village trustee candidate Anthony Clark, alleging that Clark's primary residence is in Lombard and not Oak Park.
Village trustee candidate Anthony Clark speaks during a vigil Jan. 7 outside L!VE Cafe. Clark's candidacy is being challenged by resident Kevin Peppard, with the electoral board hearing scheduled to reconvene Jan. 19. (Brian OMahoney / Pioneer Press)
Peppard said Illinois election laws require a candidate to live within the municipality for which they seek office at least one year prior to an election. Peppard provided an April 2020 bankruptcy document in which Clark provides a Lombard address as his primary residence and Oak Park as a mailing address.
Mullen, who also represented Clark, provided several documents, including identification cards, phone bills, medical bills and a W-2 which showed an Oak Park address.
Clark stated the Lombard home was purchased for a former girlfriend and their child, saying he bought the home for them while still living in Oak Park.
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"I wanted to take full responsibility as a father to provide support," Clark said. "I purchased a property in 2016 to provide them, essentially, with a better quality of living, from my perspective."
Clark said he lives with his parents in Oak Park, and is helping to care for his ailing father. Clark's mother Blanche testified at the hearing, and stated her son lives upstairs at the home.
The hearing became contentious at times, with Clark accusing Peppard of posting personal information about the challenge on social media prior to the hearing.
"I understand when you run for office, you're opening yourself up," Clark said. "You gave multiple Facebook posts like it was a movie preview. I don't know what your objective was, but I do believe that was outside this legal proceeding. I personally would not have handled myself in that way."
Peppard said he took no "glee" in any of the proceedings, merely stating he was following the law as he saw it.
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"It's a sad moment for everyone involved," Peppard said. "I appreciate Mr. Clark's past service to this community. This is entirely based on the documents and let's leave Facebook out of it."
After presenting evidence and questioning witnesses, Mullen and Peppard were asked to submit closing argument briefs by 5 p.m. Jan. 14. The electoral board then voted to reconvene the hearing Jan. 19 for any oral closing arguments and a possible decision.
The hearing took place about a week after a brick with a racist message was found outside of L!VE Cafe in Oak Park. Peppard, Abu-Taleb and others condemned the act, saying the focus was now on the legal proceedings.
"We all have a responsibility to lower the temperature down," Abu-Taleb said. "I'm calling on people not to incite divisiveness and hate among us. This is a small community and I can assure everyone in our village that this board is going to follow the facts. We're going to follow the facts and make the best possible decision for the candidate and the community. Please understand this is a responsibility we all have to take seriously."
sschering@pioneerlocal.com
Twitter: @steveschering
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redpajama_set_name: RedPajamaCommonCrawl


Three thousand feet above China, it was Jake's turn to jump. He slid his pistol, knife, and ration packets into the pockets of his leather jacket and edged toward the open hatch of the B-25 bomber. He checked the tension on the harness of his parachute, made sure the handle of the ripcord was free, and then began lowering himself out of the hatch and into the darkness. One of the famous Doolittle Raiders who first attacked Japan after the bombing of Pearl Harbor, Jacob DeShazer (1912-2008) knew this one-way mission was dangerous. Indeed, it led to his capture as a prisoner of war. Beaten, malnourished, and alone in his cell, Jacob was given a Bible - and far away from home, this American soldier became a Christian. After the war, Jacob returned to Japan and served his former enemy for thirty years as a missionary. His testimony of forgiveness and reconciliation - of love over hate - inspires a powerful gospel message for our lives today.


Treat a loved one to this hand printed, recycled card. Illustration by Julia Ogden.It is screen printed from a delicate pen drawing. Made in Yorkshire with care. Free postage and packaging in the UK.
Comes with coloured envelope and biodegradable packaging.


text:
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Citibase Milton Keynes Norfolk House East Entrance 499 Silbury Boulevard Milton Keynes Buckinghamshire MK9 2AH
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Milton Keynes is a large town situated in Buckinghamshire, England. It is locally known as MK and was formally a new town in 1967 with the design brief to become a "city" in scale. The town is located 45 miles away from the north-west of London and is fantastic for transport links in and out of the city.
The British town has covered a land which has had a vast amount of history. The Milton Keynes area was mainly farmland and villages dating back to the Bronze Age. Before Milton Keynes was constructed, every area was under archaeological investigation. This provided a interesting view into the history of a large sample of landscape of the south of England uncovering evidence form the Iron Age, Romano-British, Anglo-Saxon, Anglo- Norman, Medieval and Industrial Age. The biggest part of Milton Keynes's history is that Bletchley Park was the site of the World War II British code breaking and Colossus, the world's first programmable electronic digital computer.
Milton Keynes also has a fantastic music scene with the open air National Bowl being its largest venue. The National Bowl has a capacity of a huge 65,000 people hosting multiple music acts such as Genesis, Peter Gabriel, Queen, Metallica and Michael Jackson to name a few. The Milton Keynes Theatre is also a very popular and modern venue opening in 1999. The Theatre can seat about 1,000 people and the stage has been designed to adapt to different sizes as the ceiling can be lowered depending on the scale of the production. The theatre has hosted a number of West End productions, opera and ballet performances to name a few. There is also a very popular music venue in Milton Keynes which is called The Stables. The venue has a 400 seat auditorium and an 80 seat studio space. On the 40th February, The Stables celebrated its 40th Anniversary on the 6th February 2010 with a gala concert.
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Kent Anderson's stunning debut novel is a modern classic, a harrowing, authentic picture of one American soldier's experience of the Vietnam War–"unlike anything else in war literature" (Los Angeles Review of Books).
Hanson joins the Green Berets fresh out of college. Carrying a volume of Yeats's poems in his uniform pocket, he has no idea of what he's about to face in Vietnam–from the enemy, from his fellow soldiers, or within himself. In vivid, nightmarish, and finely etched prose, Kent Anderson takes us through Hanson's two tours of duty and a bitter, ill-fated return to civilian life in-between, capturing the day-to-day process of war like no writer before or since.


text:
Chesterfield Corporation Tramways 4, Burlington Street
The end of 2004 marked the centenary of the electric tramways in Chesterfield, a town in Derbyshire perhaps better known for its Church of St Mary and All Saints with the twisted spire. Our postcard shows car 4 driven by motorman Stone and stopping in Burlington Street on its way to Brampton. It is card number 493 in the "Scott" series published by Scott Russell & Co. of Birmingham and printed in Saxony. The object hanging on the right hand wall is a metal replica beehive, the trademark of the Beehive Drapery.
Tramways in Chesterfield began life as standard gauge horse lines operated from 8th November 1882 by the Chesterfield and District Tramways Company and taken over by the Corporation on 22nd November 1897. The Corporation ran the tramway well and set about electrifying it in August 1904. It was passed by the Board of Trade inspector on 19th December 1904. There is some doubt over when the public service actually started, 20th, 21st and 23rd all being quoted by different sources. The system was just a line single track with passing loops forming a route of 3.6 miles in length from Brampton to Whittington Moor via the Market Place, operated in two halves.
Car 4 in our postcard was one of a batch of twelve open top cars built by the Brush Electrical Engineering Company Limited of Loughborough for the opening of the tramway in 1904. They seated 22 downstairs and 34 upstairs and had Brush Conaty 8ft 6in wheelbase radial 4-wheel trucks with two Westinghouse 25 horse power motors supplied with electricity via Westinghouse 90 controllers. The fleet was later extended with two additional cars from Brush in 1907 and three top covered open balcony cars in 1914 and there was a water car from Brush in 1909. Seven cars were fitted with top covers in 1919/20. The livery was carmine red (maroon) and primrose.
The system's life was fairly uneventful but also unprofitable. In 1916 a depot fire destroyed two cars and damaged several others and in 1926 a broken axle caused car 8 to run away on Stonegravels hill and derail at the Albert Street loop, hitting a butcher's shop but without causing casualties. The worn condition of the tramway brought about its replacement with a fleet of 14 single deck Straker-Clough trolleybuses from 23rd May 1927, the last tram being car 14. The trolleybuses were themselves replaced by motor buses on 24th March 1938. Chesterfield electric car 7 and horse car 8 are preserved at the National Tramway Museum at Crich, Derbyshire.


text:
Klaudia Maruszewska (née le ) est une athlète polonaise, spécialiste du lancer du javelot.

Biographie

En 2016, elle remporte la médaille d'or du lancer du javelot lors des championnats du monde juniors, à Bydgoszcz, avec la marque de .

Palmarès

Records

Notes et références

Liens externes

Lanceuse de javelot polonaise
Championne du monde junior d'athlétisme
Naissance en août 1997

redpajama_set_name: RedPajamaWikipedia


text:
Granada ( grə-NAH-də, Spanish: [ɡɾaˈnaða]) , locally [ɡɾaˈna] is the capital city of the province of Granada, in the autonomous community of Andalusia, Spain. Granada is located at the foot of the Sierra Nevada mountains, at the confluence of four rivers, the Darro, the Genil, the Monachil and the Beiro. It sits at an average elevation of 738 m (2,421 ft) above sea level, yet is only one hour by car from the Mediterranean coast, the Costa Tropical. Nearby is the Sierra Nevada Ski Station, where the FIS Alpine World Ski Championships 1996 were held.
In the 2005 national census, the population of the city of Granada proper was 236,982, and the population of the entire urban area was estimated to be 472,638, ranking as the 13th-largest urban area of Spain. About 3.3% of the population did not hold Spanish citizenship, the largest number of these people (31%; or 1% of the total population) coming from South America. Its nearest airport is Federico García Lorca Granada-Jaén Airport.
The Alhambra, an Arab citadel and palace, is located in Granada. It is the most renowned building of the Islamic historical legacy with its many cultural attractions that make Granada a popular destination among the tourist cities of Spain. The Almohad influence on architecture is also preserved in the Granada neighborhood called the Albaicín with its fine examples of Moorish and Morisco construction.  Granada is also well-known within Spain for the University of Granada which has an estimated 82,000 students spread over five different campuses in the city.  The pomegranate (in Spanish, granada) is the heraldic device of Granada.
Granada Spain
Granada Fc
Granada Weather
Granada Wetter
Granada Alhambra
Granada Luxury Belek
Granada Spanien
Granada Fruta
Granada City in Spain
Lake Nicaragua Lake in Nicaragua
Granada CF Football club
Alhambra Palace in Granada, Spain
Granada Musical group
Granada Song by Agustín Lara
Pomegranate Fruit
University of Granada Public university in Granada, Spain
Nueva Granada Military University Public university in Bogotá, Colombia
Granada City in Nicaragua
Grenada Country in the Caribbean
Graziella Granata Italian film actress
Federico García Lorca Granada Airport Airport in Spain
Granada Hills Neighborhood in Los Angeles, California
Republic of New Granada Country
Alhama de Granada Town in Spain
Baza Town in Spain
Lara: Granada Song by José Carreras, Luciano Pavarotti, and Plácido Domingo
Granada Town in Colorado
Muhammad XII of Granada Ruler
Granada Song by Plácido Domingo
Nuevo Estadio de Los Cármenes Stadium in Granada, Spain
Granada War War
Granada Town in Colombia
Granada railway station Train station in Granada, Spain
Club Recreativo Granada Football team
Sweet granadilla Plants
Fundación CB Granada Basketball team
ITV Granada Company
ITV Studios Television company
Loja Town in Spain
Gor Town in Spain
Moto Hospitality Company
ITV plc Media company
Colombia Country in South America
Granada Video game
Murciana goat Goat breed
Granada CF vs Real Madrid CF Event
Jun, Granada Township in Spain
FC BARCELONE / GRANADA Event
Granada City in Minnesota
Jete, Granada Municipality in Spain
Muhammad I of Granada Ruler
legadonazari.blogspot.com
www.capillarealgranada.com
www.cervantesvirtual.com
www.coralgables.com
www.granada-in.com
www.granadatur.com
www.guiasdegranada.com
hitchhikershandbook.com
www.hitchhikershandbook.com
www.railjournal.com
City in Spain
Desc: Granada, locally is the capital city of the province of Granada, in the autonomous community of Andalusia, Spain. Granada is located at the foot of the Sierra Nevada mountains, at the confluence of four rivers, the Darro, the Genil, the Monachil and the Beiro.
URL: http://www.granada.org/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada
Type: City, LandmarksOrHistoricalBuildings, AdministrativeArea, Thing, Place
Lake in Nicaragua
Desc: Lake Nicaragua or Cocibolca or Granada is a freshwater lake in Nicaragua. Of tectonic origin and with an area of 8,264 km², it is the largest lake in Central America, the 19th largest lake in the world and the tenth largest in the Americas, slightly smaller than Lake Titicaca.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Nicaragua
Type: BodyOfWater, LakeBodyOfWater, Thing, Place
Desc: Granada Club de Fútbol, or simply Granada, is a Spanish football club in Granada, in the autonomous community of Andalusia. Founded on 14 April 1931, it plays in the La Liga. The club plays its home matches at the Estadio Nuevo Los Cármenes.
URL: http://www.granadacf.es/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_CF
Palace in Granada, Spain
Desc: The Alhambra is a palace and fortress complex located in Granada, Andalusia, Spain. It was originally constructed as a small fortress in AD 889 on the remains of Roman fortifications, and then largely ignored until its ruins were renovated and rebuilt in the mid-13th century by the Nasrid emir Mohammed ben Al-Ahmar of the Emirate of Granada, who built its current palace and walls.
URL: http://www.alhambra.org/esp/index.asp?secc=/inicio&popup=1
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alhambra
Type: TouristAttraction, Museum, LandmarksOrHistoricalBuildings, Thing, Place
Type: Thing, MusicGroup
Song by Agustín Lara
Desc: "Granada" is a song written in 1932 by Mexican composer Agustín Lara. The song is about the Spanish city of Granada and has become a standard in music repertoire.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_(song)
Type: MusicComposition, Thing
Desc: The pomegranate is a fruit-bearing deciduous shrub in the family Lythraceae, subfamily Punicoideae, that grows between 5 and 10 m tall.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomegranate
Public university in Granada, Spain
Desc: The University of Granada is a public university located in the city of Granada, Spain, and founded in 1531 by Emperor Charles V. With approximately 80,000 students, it is the fourth largest university in Spain. Apart from the city of Granada, UGR also has campuses in Northern Africa.
URL: http://www.ugr.es/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Granada
Type: CollegeOrUniversity, Organization, Corporation, EducationalOrganization, Thing, Place
Nueva Granada Military University
Public university in Bogotá, Colombia
Desc: The Nueva Granada Military University, also called UMNG, is a public, private, self-funded, national, coeducational university based in the city of Bogotá, Colombia.
URL: http://www.umng.edu.co
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nueva_Granada_Military_University
Type: CollegeOrUniversity, Organization, EducationalOrganization, Thing, Place
City in Nicaragua
Desc: Granada is a city in western Nicaragua and the capital of the Granada Department. With an estimated population of 123,697, it is Nicaragua's sixth most populous city.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada,_Nicaragua
Type: City, Thing, Place
Country in the Caribbean
Desc: Grenada is a sovereign state in the West Indies in the Caribbean Sea at the southern end of the Grenadines island chain. Grenada consists of the island of Grenada itself plus six smaller islands which lie to the north of the main island.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grenada
Type: AdministrativeArea, Country, Thing, Place
Graziella Granata
Italian film actress
Desc: Graziella Granata is an Italian retired film and stage actress.
After graduating at the Centro Sperimentale di Cinematografia, and after some secondary roles in adventure films and comedies, thanks to a film contract with Angelo Rizzoli film production Graziella Granata from the mid-sixties obtained good roles in films of a certain importance.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graziella_Granata
Federico García Lorca Granada Airport
Airport in Spain
Desc: Federico García Lorca Granada-Jaén Airport, also known as Granada Airport, is the airport serving the province and city of Granada, in Spain, although it has Jaén in its name.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federico_Garc%C3%ADa_Lorca_Granada_Airport
Type: Airport, Thing, Place
Neighborhood in Los Angeles, California
Desc: Granada Hills is a lightly populated, highly diverse and high-income neighborhood. It is a suburban residential community in the San Fernando Valley portion of the city of Los Angeles, California.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_Hills,_Los_Angeles
Republic of New Granada
Desc: The Republic of New Granada was a centralist unitary republic consisting primarily of present-day Colombia and Panama with smaller portions of today's Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Venezuela, Peru, and Brazil.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_New_Granada
Town in Spain
Desc: Alhama de Granada is a town in the province of Granada, approx. 50 km from the city of Granada. The name is derived from the thermal baths located there, which are called الـحَـمّـة al-hammah in Arabic.
URL: http://www.alhama.org/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alhama_de_Granada
Desc: Baza is a town in the province of Granada in Andalusia, twice a former Catholic bishopric and now a Latin Catholic titular see as Basti.
URL: http://www.bazaweb.com/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baza,_Granada
Lara: Granada
Song by José Carreras, Luciano Pavarotti, and Plácido Domingo
Town in Colorado
Desc: Granada is a Statutory Town in Prowers County, Colorado, United States. The population was 640 at the 2000 census.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada,_Colorado
Muhammad XII of Granada
Desc: Abu Abdallah Muhammad XII, known in Europe as Boabdil, was the 22nd and last Nasrid ruler of the Emirate of Granada in Iberia.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_XII_of_Granada
Song by Plácido Domingo
Nuevo Estadio de Los Cármenes
Stadium in Granada, Spain
Desc: Nuevo Estadio de Los Cármenes is a multi-use stadium in Granada, Spain. Currently, it is used mostly for football matches. The stadium holds 19,336 people, and was built in 1995 to be the home ground of Granada CF, the main football club of the city.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuevo_Estadio_de_Los_C%C3%A1rmenes
Type: StadiumOrArena, TouristAttraction, Thing, Place
Granada War
Desc: The Granada War was a series of military campaigns between 1482 and 1491, during the reign of the Catholic Monarchs Isabella I of Castile and Ferdinand II of Aragon, against the Nasrid dynasty's Emirate of Granada.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_War
Type: Event, Thing
Town in Colombia
Desc: Granada is a town and municipality in the Colombian department of Antioquia. It is part of the subregion of Eastern Antioquia. For More Info Amigranada
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada,_Antioquia
Granada railway station
Train station in Granada, Spain
Desc: Granada railway station is the main railway station of the Spanish city of Granada, Andalusia.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_railway_station
Type: Thing, Place, Airport
Desc: Club Recreativo Granada is a Spanish football team based in Granada, in the autonomous community of Andalusia. Founded in 1947, it is the reserve team of Granada CF and currently plays in Segunda División B – Group 4, holding home games at Estadio Miguel Prieto, with a capacity for 2,500 spectators.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Club_Recreativo_Granada
Type: Thing, SportsTeam
Sweet granadilla
Desc: Passiflora ligularis, commonly known as the sweet granadilla or grenadia, is a plant species in the genus Passiflora. It is known as granadilla in Bolivia, Colombia, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Mexico and Peru; granadilla común in Guatemala; granadilla de China or parcha dulce in Venezuela and granaditta in Jamaica.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passiflora_ligularis
Fundación CB Granada
Desc: Fundación Club Baloncesto Granada, also known as Covirán Granada by sponsorship reasons, is a basketball team based in Granada, Andalusia, Spain that currently plays in LEB Oro.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundaci%C3%B3n_CB_Granada
ITV Granada
Desc: ITV Granada is a regional television company in North West England. It is the largest independent television-franchise producing company in the UK, accounting for 25% of the total broadcasting output of the ITV network.
URL: http://www.itv.com/granada
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITV_Granada
Type: Organization, Thing, Corporation
Television company
Desc: ITV Studios is a television production company owned by the British television broadcaster ITV plc. Based in 12 countries across 60 production labels, with local production offices in the UK, America, Australia, Germany, Holland, Italy, Israel, France and Scandinavia.
URL: http://www.itv.com/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITV_Studios
Desc: Loja, formerly Loxa, is a town in southern Spain, situated at the western limit of the province of Granada. It is surrounded by the so-called Sierra de Loja, of which the highest peak, Sierra Gorda, stands 1,671 metres above sea-level.
URL: http://www.aytoloja.org/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loja,_Granada
Desc: Gor is a town of Granada, in southwestern Spain. It consists of the town center and several suburbs scattered all over its municipal area, such as Las Juntas, Las Viñas, Cenascuras, Los Balcones, La Rambla Valdiquín, Los corrales, El Royo Serval and La Estación de Gorafe.
URL: http://www.asociacionamigosdegor.es/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gor,_Granada
Moto Hospitality
Desc: Moto Hospitality is a company which operates 58 motorway service stations across the United Kingdom. It is currently the UK's biggest service area operator. Moto is owned by USS, who bought it from Macquarie.
URL: http://www.moto-way.com/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moto_Hospitality
Desc: ITV plc is a British media company based in London, England. It holds 13 of the 15 regional television licences that make up the ITV network, the oldest and largest commercial terrestrial television network in the United Kingdom.
URL: http://www.itvplc.com/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITV_plc
Country in South America
Desc: Colombia, officially the Republic of Colombia, is a country largely situated in the north of South America, with land and territories in North America.
URL: http://www.colombia.co/en/
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colombia
Desc: Granada is a shooter video game developed and originally published by Wolf Team exclusively for the Sharp X68000 in Japan on 20 April 1990.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada_(video_game)
Type: VideoGame, Thing
Murciana goat
Goat breed
Desc: The Murciano-Granadina is a Spanish breed of dairy goat. It was created in 1975 when two existing breeds, the mahogany-coloured Murciana of Murcia and the black Granadina of Granada, began to be hybridised as a result of the official recognition of a single herdbook including both breeds.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murciano-Granadina
Granada CF vs Real Madrid CF
Jun, Granada
Township in Spain
Desc: Jun is a Spanish locality and township situated in the north-centre part of la Vega de Granada, in the province of Granada, autonomous community of Andalucía. It limits with the municipalities of Pulianas, Granada, Alfacar and Víznar.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jun,_Granada
FC BARCELONE / GRANADA
City in Minnesota
Desc: Granada is a city in Martin County, Minnesota, United States. Continuously populated since the late 19th century and booming during World War II, the population declined significantly thereafter and recorded at 303 as of the 2010 census.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granada,_Minnesota
Type: City, AdministrativeArea, Thing, Place
Jete, Granada
Municipality in Spain
Desc: Jete is a municipality located in the province of Granada, Spain. According to the 2004 census, the city has a population of 768 inhabitants.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jete,_Granada
Muhammad I of Granada
Desc: Abu Abdullah Muhammad ibn Yusuf ibn Nasr, also known as Ibn al-Aḥmar and by his epithet al-Ghalib billah, was the first ruler of the Emirate of Granada, the last independent Muslim state on the Iberian Peninsula, and the founder of its ruling Nasrid dynasty.
Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_I_of_Granada


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Tanzania is a remarkable destination. It is the most bio-diverse country in mainland Africa, harboring incomparable natural wealth. Vast wilderness areas where the rhythms of ancient migrations still beat, Endemic fauna and flora, colorful African cultures, and dramatic landscapes. Through the years, we have worked in every corner of Tanzania. From the peak of Kilimanjaro to the backcountry of the Udzungwa scarp forests. We led diving expeditions to the sheer coral-crusted walls of southern Pemba, participated in coming of age ceremonies in the seldom visited south Maasailand, and camped in the Kitulo plateau, witnessing one of the world's great floral spectacles.
Tanzania is open and we welcome guests.
CONSESSIONS & RESERVES
More than 30% of Tanzania's area is officially protected – a monumental tribute to its natural wealth and the commitment of its people to defend it. Much of this area comprises national parks, Game & Forest reserves, and marine parks, while other wilderness areas fall under the management of local communities and private concession holders. We operate regularly in many of these Parks and concessions and many village areas. In addition, we built great relationships throughout Tanzania and further afield in East Africa, ensuring that we can pursue your interests and operate virtually anywhere in east Africa when the need arises.
Max was an absolute pleasure; very professional and fun to be with. His Knowledge of mammals, birds, and the parks was astounding. We learned new things every day. He feels like a friend we will miss and come back to see again someday!
Alex Eby, USA
Our safari was amazing, simply perfect. The camp in the Serengeti was a clear highlight; the lions, the cheetahs, and the vast herds of Wildebeest crossing the Mara River.
This was one of the best experiences of our lives. Every lodge was dead on and wonderfully surprising. I really can't thank you enough!
Tair Kovalski