Daniel Ellsberg Explains Why He Leaked The Pentagon Papers : NPR
Daniel Ellsberg
Daniel Ellsberg  Explains Why  He  Leaked The Pentagon Papers
In 1971   Ellsberg  leaked the Pentagon Papers to the press in the hope that they would help end the Vietnam War.  His  story is portrayed in the new film The Post. Originally broadcast Dec. 4  2017.
This is FRESH AIR. I'm Dave Davies  in for Terry Gross.  Our next guest  Daniel Ellsberg   became one of the best-known opponents of the Vietnam War in 1971 when  he  leaked a secret Defense Department study of the war that came to be known as the Pentagon Papers to the country's leading newspapers. That story is the basis for the new film "The Post" starring Tom Hanks and Meryl Streep. In this scene  Washington Post editor Ben Bagdikian is meeting  Ellsberg   who's hiding out in a motel  eluding an FBI manhunt. Piles of papers are spread out over the two beds in the room. Matthew Rhys plays  Ellsberg . Bob Odenkirk plays Bagdikian.
MATTHEW RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Ben.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) The study had 47 volumes. I slipped out a couple at a time - took me months to copy it all.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Well  we were all former government guys - top clearance - all that. McNamara wanted academics to have the chance to examine what had happened. He would say to us  let the chips fall where they may.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Well  I think guilt was a bigger motivator than courage. McNamara lies as well as the rest  but I don't think he saw what was coming  what we'd find. But it didn't take him long to figure out - well  for us all to figure out. If the public ever saw these papers  they would turn against the war. Covert ops  guaranteed debt  rigged elections - it's all in there. Ike  Kennedy  Johnson. They violated the Geneva Convention. They lied to Congress  and they lied to the public. They knew we couldn't win and still sent boys to die.
DAVIES:  Daniel Ellsberg   now 86  has a new book about  his  days before the Vietnam War when  he  worked on American nuclear war strategies in the late '50s and early '60s.  Ellsberg  was appalled by much of what  he  found and wishes  he 'd been able to leak those plans along with the Pentagon Papers.  His  book is called "The Doomsday Machine."
DAVIES: Well   Daniel Ellsberg   welcome to FRESH AIR. You became famous for leaking the Pentagon Papers to The New York Times and other publications. And you tell us at the beginning of this book that you copied not just the Vietnam study but a lot of other material from your safe at the RAND Corporation about U.S. nuclear war plans. What were you going to do with that material?
DAVIES: My guest is  Daniel Ellsberg .  His  new book is "The Doomsday Machine." We'll continue our conversation after just a short break. This is FRESH AIR.
DAVIES: This is FRESH AIR  and we're speaking with  Daniel Ellsberg . You'll remember that  he  leaked the Pentagon Papers to The New York Times and other publications.  He  has a new book called "The Doomsday Machine: Confessions Of A Nuclear War Planner" about  his  early days doing nuclear war planning for the Air Force.
 ELLSBERG : Pardon me. I think I'm going to make it clear  but I wouldn't even want the question - to raise that question  in a way. I am a patriot  and that has never changed.
 ELLSBERG : Without young men going to prison for nonviolent protests against the draft  men that I met on their way to prison  no Pentagon Papers. It wouldn't have occurred to  me  simply to do something that would put  myself  in prison for the rest of my life  as I assumed that would do. So  obviously  that was not an obvious decision to make  except once I'd seen the example of people like Randy Kehler and Bob Eaton and others and David Harris  who did go to prison to say that this war was wrong - the Vietnam War was wrong - and that they refused to participate in it.
 ELLSBERG : Well  in those days  it was one page at a time. We didn't have these zip  zip  multi-page collators and whatnot machines that they have now or the - of course  the digital capability. So it took me a long time - months  actually.
 ELLSBERG : Yes.
 ELLSBERG : Well  twice in that office  which was a small advertising office owned by a friend of a friend  really - twice during that period  police came to the door because she had turned the key the wrong way and set off the burglar alarm. And on one of those occasions  my children were there. That was the one time. Police came in and found my son running the Xerox machine.
[TGT] Explains Why   [TGT]   Leaked The Pentagon Papers
In 1971   Ellsberg  leaked the Pentagon Papers to the press in the hope that they would help end the Vietnam War.   [TGT]   story is portrayed in the new film The Post. Originally broadcast Dec. 4  2017.
This is FRESH AIR. I'm Dave Davies  in for Terry Gross.   [TGT] became one of the best-known opponents of the Vietnam War in 1971 when   [TGT]   leaked a secret Defense Department study of the war that came to be known as the Pentagon Papers to the country's leading newspapers. That story is the basis for the new film "The Post" starring Tom Hanks and Meryl Streep. In this scene  Washington Post editor Ben Bagdikian is meeting  Ellsberg   who's hiding out in a motel  eluding an FBI manhunt. Piles of papers are spread out over the two beds in the room. Matthew Rhys plays  Ellsberg . Bob Odenkirk plays Bagdikian.
MATTHEW RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Ben.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) The study had 47 volumes. I slipped out a couple at a time - took me months to copy it all.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Well  we were all former government guys - top clearance - all that. McNamara wanted academics to have the chance to examine what had happened. He would say to us  let the chips fall where they may.
RHYS: (As Daniel Ellsberg) Well  I think guilt was a bigger motivator than courage. McNamara lies as well as the rest  but I don't think he saw what was coming  what we'd find. But it didn't take him long to figure out - well  for us all to figure out. If the public ever saw these papers  they would turn against the war. Covert ops  guaranteed debt  rigged elections - it's all in there. Ike  Kennedy  Johnson. They violated the Geneva Convention. They lied to Congress  and they lied to the public. They knew we couldn't win and still sent boys to die.
DAVIES:   [TGT]    now 86  has a new book about   [TGT]   days before the Vietnam War when   [TGT]   worked on American nuclear war strategies in the late '50s and early '60s.   [TGT] was appalled by much of what   [TGT]   found and wishes   [TGT]  'd been able to leak those plans along with the Pentagon Papers.   [TGT]   book is called "The Doomsday Machine."
DAVIES: Well    [TGT]    welcome to FRESH AIR. You became famous for leaking the Pentagon Papers to The New York Times and other publications. And you tell us at the beginning of this book that you copied not just the Vietnam study but a lot of other material from your safe at the RAND Corporation about U.S. nuclear war plans. What were you going to do with that material?
DAVIES: My guest is   [TGT]  .  His  new book is "The Doomsday Machine." We'll continue our conversation after just a short break. This is FRESH AIR.
DAVIES: This is FRESH AIR  and we're speaking with  [TGT]  . You'll remember that   [TGT]   leaked the Pentagon Papers to The New York Times and other publications.   [TGT]   has a new book called "The Doomsday Machine: Confessions Of A Nuclear War Planner" about   [TGT]   early days doing nuclear war planning for the Air Force.
  [TGT]  : Pardon me. I think I'm going to make it clear  but I wouldn't even want the question - to raise that question  in a way. I am a patriot  and that has never changed.
  [TGT]  : Without young men going to prison for nonviolent protests against the draft  men that I met on their way to prison  no Pentagon Papers. It wouldn't have occurred to  me  simply to do something that would put  myself  in prison for the rest of my life  as I assumed that would do. So  obviously  that was not an obvious decision to make  except once I'd seen the example of people like Randy Kehler and Bob Eaton and others and David Harris  who did go to prison to say that this war was wrong - the Vietnam War was wrong - and that they refused to participate in it.
  [TGT]  : Well  in those days  it was one page at a time. We didn't have these zip  zip  multi-page collators and whatnot machines that they have now or the - of course  the digital capability. So it took me a long time - months  actually.
 ELLSBERG : Yes.
 ELLSBERG : Well  twice in that office  which was a small advertising office owned by a friend of a friend  really - twice during that period  police came to the door because she had turned the key the wrong way and set off the burglar alarm. And on one of those occasions  my children were there. That was the one time. Police came in and found my son running the Xerox machine.