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Originally posted by Mary Rose
the natural C=256 tuning is grounded in the physical laws of our universe
Assuming the above statement is untrue, according to the premise of this thread, because it's based on frequency measured, in error, spatially - then, how should the physical laws of our universe be expressed?
Forget healing for the time being.
Just talk music, please.
An equidistant frequency distribution is not a good match to the human hearing system, but more appropriate distributions such an exponential frequency scale are subject to the same considerations on spectral leakage, as is illustrated by the spectrographic reconstructions in the figure below. So there can be an effective localization in both time and frequency under the limitations imposed by the frequency-time uncertainty relation: the product of the uncertainty-in-frequency times the uncertainty-in-time will always be at least one over two pi (i.e., about 0.15915). This same relation lies at the heart of quantum mechanics, where the Heisenberg uncertainty principle applies to energy and time, because energy is, via Planck's constant, proportional to the frequency of probability waves.262
So the most precise sound perception, perceiving sound as vision, relies on this quantum timefrequency uncertainty relation. Similarly just as people “see what they believe” we also “hear what we listen to” – people hear what they believe and these “phantom sounds” can be emptied out or resolved through nonlinear feedback: Schlee’s results suggest that the higher regions of the brain send their own
feedback to the auditory cortex, amplifying its false signals. Schlee’s model of
tinnitus and consciousness could explain some curious observations. Even in bad
cases of tinnitus, people can become unaware of the phantom sound if they are
distracted. It may be that distractions deprive the errant signals from the auditory
cortex of the attention they need to cause real distress. What’s more, some of the
most effective treatments for tinnitus appear to work by altering the behavior of
the front of the brain. Counseling, for example, can make people better aware of
the sounds they experience by explaining the brain process that may underlie the
disorder, so they can consciously reduce their distress.263
All I'm saying is the Perfect Fifth and Perfect Fourth as the same as yin and yang and inversely yin and yang are the same as the Perfect fifth and Perfect Fourth.
Originally posted by DenyObfuscation
reply to post by fulllotusqigong
All I'm asking is why anything you say about western tuning is not then applicable to your yin and yang. The noncommutative bait and switch on the 4th and 5th seems to be a basic premise of the theory. It's a very simple and obvious question.
Schroeder states how amazing it is that the difference between rational and irrational numbers actually determine the creation of chaos – that chaos is simply the irrational number extending the digits unpredictably and never repeating: In fact, the deterministic chaos, which dominates many a physical discussion
these days, is ultimately understandable in these simple terms: the evolution of a
complex number, in the final analysis, is akin to the left-shifting of digits of a real
irrational number. No matter how precisely the initial conditions are known,
temporal evolution will sooner or later bring the originally unknowable, far-right
digits (representing the exact initial conditions) into the neighborhood of the
“decimal” point, where they will dominate the system’s behavior, which will then
seem chaotic. (p. 402)
Meanwhile Schroeder states that resonance using rational, low Pythagorean integers, is too powerful and causes matter to disintegrate through nonlinear feedback.
As the book Excursions into Number Theory notes: “For instance, 99/70, the sixth convergent of square root of two, differs from square root of two by .000072; but 13/8, the sixth convergence of the Golden Ratio, differs from the Golden Ratio by .0070, showing an error nearly 100 times as large.” (p. 134)
Again 5/4 or 10/8 is the major third music interval as the complementary opposite of 8/5 the Golden Ratio minor sixth music interval. The was the “secret of the sect” equation I discovered: the music compound ratio algebra behind the geometric solution of doubling the cube as mass ritual sacrifice.
Originally posted by rwfresh
Originally posted by ThoughtForms
Originally posted by rwfresh
reply to post by UncleV
Sound can be rhythmic without containing a 'tone'
Professor Oliver Sacks’ new book Musicophilia is a treasure-trove of analysis on the mind-body conundrum from the intricacies of music. Sack previews neuroscientist Dr. Ani Patel’s Music, Language and the Brain (2008) book focusing on rhythm as subcortical binding for motor coordination with language. But as Sacks notes, Patel’s take on the Thai elephant orchestra music (of which I’m a big fan) may be questioned by some readers. Patel does prove that some animals synchronize body movement to music – not just human animals.
The answer to Sacks’ Musicofilia ponderings is amazingly found in the most famous short-story of Edgar Allen Poe who, as Edmund Wilson quotes, wrote that his goal in writing was the “indeterminateness of music.” Poe, the creator of the mystery story, gives the reversal to Freud who, Sacks states: “despised music.” In Poe’s psychoanalysis we find a direct answer to Sack’s contradiction of the phantom limb as an “overflow” of neuron sensations, in contrast to the overflowing OBE (outer body experience) as related to a musical hallucination. It’s exactly in the primal language of rhythm, more specifically Sacks’ susceptibility for syncopation, that we also solve the mind-body mystery which Poe also addressed in his famous solution to The Purloined Letter.
Poe states: “If it is any point requiring reflection we shall examine it to better purpose in the dark.” Now again, as the goal of Poe’s writing is the “indeterminateness of music” we can listen in the dark and this can be inferred as the true method of Poe’s “beyond genius” modus operandi. Poe highlights the problem of the normal detective which in our case of Sacks is the neuroscientist: “A certain set of highly ingenious resources are, with the Perfect, a sort of Procrustean bed, to which he forcibly adapts his designs. But he perpetually errors by being too deep or too shallow, for the matter in hand.” This “too deep, too shallow” issue Poe identifies is exactly the problem with the approach to the mind-body paradox.
So the phantom limb effect is determined to be caused by a neuron “overflow” (amplitude) while the binding of the mind and body is determined to be a synchronization of rhythm as timing (frequency). Sacks notes that people hear even a digital clock ticking as a “tick-tock” or a syncopated rhythm. Sack also admits that certain rhythms force both himself and other scientists to become a part of the phenomenon under study — music creates a world of perception that subsumes both the mind and body and this occurs most frequently through syncopated or asymmetric rhythm. But, just as Poe notes, the scientists as detectives are continually “too shallow” (frequency) or “too deep” (amplitude). Both frequency and amplitude are based on symmetrical studies of form and quantity, while true music is an abstract listening process of asymmetry.
Poe continues: “Mathematical axioms are not axioms of general truth.” Again what must be realized is that the math upon which science is based actually comes from music ratios — but the natural overtones of music are actually asymmetric while Western math (and music) relies on symmetric measurements. Sacks notes that people have been proven to anticipate synchronized beats — before hearing the sound. This process occurs in the subcortical regions as a very abstract binding of mind and body — without any emotion or symbolic attachment — exactly the same goal as Poe: The indeterminateness of music for a “beyond genius” state of logical inference.
Then I happened upon a c.d. – Kenyan Ritual Witchcraft Music. This c.d. has liner notes detailing how the healers use drummers which perform ritual initiation of the females by “eating” the females. This is a secret ritual so that the uninitiated really believe the female is sacrificed. What happens though is that the female energy is eaten.
Originally posted by rwfresh
Originally posted by ThoughtForms
Originally posted by rwfresh
reply to post by UncleV
Sound can be rhythmic without containing a 'tone'
So, for example, a key concept to the CIA’s Andrija Puharich and the Actual Matrix Plan is the ionosphere brain resonance and the earlier Tesla energy research. A key concept in this analysis is the ELF (extremely low frequency) waves as around 7 to 15 hertz for the earth-ionosphere resonance and also for the deep consciousness of the brain waves. This ELF 7 to 15 hertz is also the frequency of the deep brain-heart waves (in nonwestern cultures the heart is the true mind of the person). The frequency of the musical drum head is at the low ELF frequency as well and then the drumming tempo is also at 7 to 15 hertz. So both the frequency and the time of the drum then synchronize the heart-mind to the deep consciousness trance frequency, as discovered experimentally by Dr. Andrew Neher. “In 'A Physiological Explanation of Unusual Behavior in Ceremonies Involving Drums,' Human Biology, 1962, Dr. Andrew Neher suggested the predominant sound frequency in most trance drumming is about seven to nine beats per second. And independent analyses of a wide sampling of trance drumming from Asia, North and West African and black American cultures, conducted by students at Bowdoin College, under the direction of this writer, point to a range of approximately seven to 13 beats per second.”730
Originally posted by eagleeye2
Its becoming a recurring theme these days, its fascinating.
Truly fascinating, i'm speechless really.
I have always thought everything is right infront of us
We need to open our mind already, maybe faith is a part of the equation.
It made me think of Zorgon's Egyptian hieroglyph that could be a clue in the construction of the pyramids.
His theory was about acoustic reasonance, wich was really interesting.
As I thought about this possibility my mind went back to the petroglyphs in Colorado. On one rock there was a description of the "arm of God" that would be removed from "over His people." The writing in Yemen also spoke about the "aperture in the sky" that would cause terrible burning of humanity. Will the next extinction be by fire? We spent two evenings drinking Old Saigon Ale at the famous Saigon Cafe in District One. The men seemed sincere and went into details about the capabilities of the system. HAARP, it seems, can be deflected off the ionosphere and made to hit a precise location on the earth's surface. The signal can then be made to penetrate the surface and cause the mineral molecules to vibrate. At low power, these molecular vibrations can be detected from space satellites and used to reveal the presence of oil, various minerals and even underground facilities. At higher power these same molecular vibrations can cause sub-terranian tremors and even explosions. One of the men even suggested that experimental use of this "tomographic" potential had resulted in earthquakes in Iran. Both seemed sad and even angry that the program was being used irresponsibly.
According to Phra Acharn Mun, Phra Acharn Sao's character was serene and tranquil. One of his unique abilities during sitting meditation was levitation. While practicing sitting meditation, Phra Acharn Sao would sometimes feel himself floating and this caused him surprise and uncertainty. One time, in order to check out this feeling, he emerged from his meditation and opened his eyes. At that time he was about one meter away from the floor, and his sudden emergence from his meditation brought him crashing to the floor with a thud. That incident caused him a painful hip for several days. Next time he was more cautious. When he next felt himself levitating, he slowly opened his eyes with mindfulness, not completely discarding his meditation, and he saw that he was really floating above the floor! To make doubly sure, he put a small article between the nipa leaves of the thatched roof of his hut before beginning his sitting meditation. When he again felt himself levitating, he once again with mindfulness slowly took that small article in his hand, not withdrawing his mind from the state of meditation, and after that he gradually let himself down to the floor. Holding that small article in his hand, he was convinced that he had really been floating above tile floor during his meditation. This didn't happen every time, of course, but this material evidence was proof of the fact that it did occur sometimes. In other respects, however, unlike Phra Acharn Mun, the mind of Phra Acharn Sao was not so fleeting and rebellious; nor was his mode of practice spectacular, risky and comprehensive in its resources and results.
The block was one metre wide and one and one-half metres long. Then 19 musical instruments were set in an arc of 90 degrees at a distance of 63 metres from the stone slab. The radius of 63 metres was measured out accurately. The musical instruments consisted of 13 drums and six trumpets. (Ragdons). Behind each instrument was a row of monks. When the stone was in position the monk behind the small drum gave a signal to start the concert. The small drum had a very sharp sound, and could be heard even with the other instruments making a terrible din. All the monks were singing and chanting a prayer, slowly increasing the tempo of this unbelievable noise. During the first four minutes nothing happened, then as the speed of the drumming, and the noise increased, the big stone block started to rock and sway, and suddenly it took off into the air with an increasing speed in the direction of the platform...
The Harmony of Physics, Mathematics, and Music: A discovery in mathematical music theory is found to apply in physics Krantz, Richard; Douthett, Jack American Physical Society, Fall 2009 Meeting of the Four Corners Section of the APS, October 23-24, 2009, abstract #D1.056 Although it is common practice to borrow tools from mathematics to apply to physics or music, it is unusual to use tools developed in music theory to mathematically describe physical phenomena. So called ``Maximally Even Set'' theory fits this unusual case. In this poster, we summarize, by example, the theory of Maximally Even (ME) sets and show how this formalism leads to the distribution of black and white keys on the piano keyboard. We then show how ME sets lead to a generalization of the well-known ``Cycle-of-Fifths'' in music theory. Subsequently, we describe ordering in one-dimensional spin-1/2 anti-ferromagnets using ME sets showing that this description leads to a fractal ``Devil's Staircase'' magnetic phase diagram. Finally, we examine an extension of ME sets, ``Iterated Maximally Even'' sets that describes chord structure in music.
Mogens Jensen,Tomas Bohr and I, working at the University of Copenhagen, recently investigated phase locking in great detail. We found that at the transition to chaos the motion is always locked: As one changes the frequency of either oscillator - for example, by changing the length of a pendulum or the frequency of a driving force -the ratio between the two frequencies locks onto every single rational value pJq. If one subjects a pendulum to a fixed driving frequency and plots the actual frequency of the pendulum against the natural frequency or length of the pendulum,one obtains a curve consisting of an infinity of steps.
Stated slightly differently, a simple pendulum that for weak coupling almost never locks onto the driving frequency (because the resonances are extremely narrow) will for strong enough coupling always lock onto one of the infinity of resonant frequencies. If one then slowly changes the driving frequency, the pendulum will lock onto each resonant frequency, jumping from one to the next, forming an infinite series of steps.
Between any two steps there is an infinity of steps, because between any two rational numbers there is an infinity of rational numbers. It is this property of the curve that has given rise to the name “the Devil’s staircase."
Let me just further clarify. The macro quantum chaos math professor Ian Stewart writes about the "Cantor Set" fractal which is just a circle with two smaller circles a third each the size of the first circle and this is repeated infinitely. The result is an infinite fractal of finite length with the value of the number zero!! O.K. but the symbol of a circle with two smaller circles each a third of the first circle is the same as the Tai Chi symbol. This Tai Chi symbol can also be created by the sinewave oscillator -- an octave is the One as double the frequency by halving the length of the string. On an oscillator the octave is a circle but as infinite harmonics of the inverse proportions created by the Harmonic Series the sinewaves continue to create the Tai Chi symbol. Fractals are supposed to be symmetric but in fact they are asymmetric -- just as the Tai Chi symbol is because the colors of the circles are complimentary opposites. There is a deep paradox around this based on the time-frequency uncertainty principle and expressed mathematicall as "adaptive stochastic resonance" as professor Bart Kosko describes in his book "Fuzzy Logic." His forth-coming book "Noise" should be excellent. Quantum Logic also relies on a violation of the Cantor Set --- in otherwords "Time is the Image of Eternity" as Plato stated because infinite time creates Chaos that violates axiomatic logic yet the image looks symmetric. Kepler figured this out -- the essence of his science was the symbol of a circle inscribing and circumscribing an equilateral triangle. The equilateral triangle is the symbol of Pythagorean -- it's a pyramid of 10 dots. The dots represent the Law of Pythagoras -- the asymmetric Harmonic Series. So One (is not a Number) but turns into Two which turns into Three as the Infinite Many. 2:3 equals 3:4 in the Harmonic Series even though this violates Cantor Set logic!! Alain Connes states that music theory provides the formal language to understand quantum computers in his book "Triangle Thoughts" 2001. Alain Connes is the top French mathematician, the creator of Non-commutative geometry essential to macro quantum chaos. In his math 1 plus 1 does not equal 2!! An excellent number theory book is the recent "Music of the Primes" a best-seller in the U.K.
Originally posted by fulllotusqigong
Read "Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality" -- and that will give you all the secrets you want -- for free online.
Originally posted by ThoughtForms
reply to post by fulllotusqigong
Which has nothing to do with showing an earthquake does or does not sound melodious or showing that the heart does or does not make a sound. I'm sorry but I do not understand what you are saying.
Peace & goodbye,
UCLA researchers find mathematical pattern to killings | The ... ulife.com/ucla-researchers-find-mathematical-pattern-to-killings/ Jan 25, 2012 – The “Devil's Staircase” pattern has previously accounted for the frequency of natural phenomenon, such as earthquakes and avalanches
Dynamics underlying the patterning of cardiac ... - APS Link Manager link.aps.org/doi/10.1103/PhysRevLett.70.3671 by HX Wang - 1993 - Cited by 15 - Related articles premature heart beats which correspond to return cycles of a ID map are found to be organized into a devil's staircase when plotted against heart rate.
Huang-Xin Wang, Robert de Paola, and William I. Norwood The University of Pennsylvania, School of Medicine, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19104 Received 28 December 1992; published in the issue dated 7 June 1993 We use nonlinear methods to predict changes in cardiac rhythms over periods of up to several hours. The patterns of measured premature heart beats which correspond to return cycles of a 1D map are found to be organized into a devil’s staircase when plotted against heart rate. Throughout the data collections, changes in patterns with heart rate agree with the computed dynamics. This result, typical of the majority of patients examined, demonstrates that (1) simple recursions can model complex biological rhythms and (2) mode locking can play a dominant role in the patterning of arrhythmias. © 1993 The American Physical Society
In figure 4 (below), Bak represents the accumulated mutations for a certain species over time. We can observe the intercalated periods of stasis and avalanches of changes for this species. The horizontal line after a mutation shows stasis and the vertical jumps representing mutations indicate the avalanches of change. This curve with many small jumps and few big jumps is called the 'Devil's staircase'. The periods of stasis are generally much longer than the periods of 'busts'. Bak establishes that the structure of this curve is very similar to that found in data about mutations in the physical size of some natural species. This and other comparisons with data from biological evolution cause Bak to suggest that "The actual statistical properties of the extinction record supports the view that biological evolution is a critically self-organised phenomenon."
Originally posted by UncleV
Hmmm, thanks for the replies, can't say I still understand it but I'll take that as my ignorance at this point.
One thing in your replies over the course is when we talk about going C to G (fifth) and build upward, as in the western circle of fifth that it is indeed 'off'. Where I choose to build is each note individually, which is why I rely on the hertz measurement. Building your harmonies from each start note I believe gives us more true relationships. Western music does indeed temper this.
I'm sorry if this is redundant but with so much material it becomes a blur - could you explain what the 'small universe' exercise is and how to practice it?
Originally posted by TruthIncarnate
This whole thread inspired me to learn the guitar, i think thats the only way i will ever be able to comprehend anything anybody on this thread is talking about.
By the time Bach was writing music, conservatives were losing the battle over the tritone. Bach used it in certain situations, and eventually it became even more acceptable. Today, it is a natural and expected component of our music. Even the most conservative among us have no problem with the “Devil’s interval.”
The music analyst John Chernoff in his brilliant work with the Dagomba, African Sensibility: Aesthetics and Social Action in African Musical Idioms, notes that "The power and dynamic potential of the music is in the silence, and the gaps between the notes, [the absolute void] and it is into this openness that a creative participant will place his contribution, trying to open up the music further." Chernoff realized that music serves as a conscious cultural practice to access the void and obtain transformative powers in these cultures. He points out that "both [the dialectical Marcuse and Lacan] are suggestive of ways in which Western philosophical literature on alienation is addressed in the aesthetics of African music."(124)
Taking Zizek quite literally is more appropriate then he may ever realize for it is exactly the nodes of music theory, by modeling different orders of information, that so precisely describe the dialectical process. The ratios of the fourth and the fifth are inverse opposites of the octave overtone, in other words, both ratios cause a pull to resolve at the fundamental (and octave). When the ratios are explored at depth, the relation of their overtones are in dissonance. As Rothstein describes, "These two consonant tones (fifth and fundamental) have strongly dissonant overtones...[and] are the poles of tonal musical drama."(105)
It's this paradox of the poles that defines the description of thesis and antithesis in the dialectics of music theory. Erno Lendvai states, By taking a V-I cadence the essential notes in the five chord bear an equal tritonic relationship according to their overtones. These essential notes are what cause the strong feeling to I. By inverting these notes the same tritone relationship is formed...The tritones' overtones act as subdominants [fourths] and as dominants [fifths] at the same time. These two positions neutralize and again, the tritone's relationship to the tonic [fundamental] is found, the two are acoustically interchangeable.(106)
Jeans provides the following on the topic: "In the case of wider intervals such as C and F# [the tritone] there are no beats to be heard, either pleasant or unpleasant, but Helmholtz asserted that C and F# sound badly together because certain of their harmonics (e.g. g' and f'#) make unpleasant beats."(107)
The dialectical process is demonstrated through true music theory by the splitting of nothing (the root of the fundamental) into two parts, the fundamental and the octave, that freely resonate into the next multiple of the fifth, forming a complimentary opposites to the fundamental: the fifth splits the octave and fundamental in half but also pulls to the octave and fundamental. Then, as described by Lendvai, the free vibration of the fifth and its overtone become extreme opposites to the fundamental, via the overtone, forming tritonic relations to the tonic (the tritone is known as "the unutterable" or "diabulus in musica".)(108) But the tritone has no beats (zero) with the fundamental - thus forming the first negation. The tritone overtones then act as the original consonant fifth to the fundamental (with no beats), as described by Lendvai, thus completing the double negation or determinate reflection for the new synthesis. This final synthesis is on-going, represented by the spiral of fifths (not the incorrect circle of fifths taught in the west) that's basic to true music theory--or again, the same beautiful "nodal problem" again and again.
Conscious events are seen as being capable of grasping a whole pattern of activity, and this in turn is seen as accounting for the unity of consciousness. Stapp envisages a top level of brain processing involved with information gathering, planning of actions, choice of particular plans and execution and monitoring of these plans. It is suggested that each top-level event is linked to a psychological event, which connects the psychological to the quantum. Each human conscious experience is seen as a ‘feel’ of an event in the top level of processing in the human brain.